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Rumour Xbox First Party going third party/multiplat - Discussing and Summary Thread (UPDATE: 4 Xbox exclusives are coming to Nintendo Switch and PS5)

Kameo, Grabbed by the Ghoulies and PD Zero being brought over to Switch/Switch 2 would make for a funny avant garde story considering those titles started off as GCN games before the buyout.
 
Dinoman96 said:
Kameo, Grabbed by the Ghoulies and PD Zero being brought over to Switch/Switch 2 would make for a funny avant garde story considering those titles started off as GCN games before the buyout.
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Not by Rare but Too Human is also like that. Started as a GameCube game, it was a part of GCN's pre-release lineup. They released the unfinished game on 360, yet I wouldn't say no to a Switch port. It wasn't THAT bad.
 
now I'm thinking a future where Gamepass is part of the NSO plan as its own third party tier on Switch (2) is more possible than ever (tho it'd be limited to Microsoft published titles).

No real reason to prevent it from Nintendo end if that means getting a cut on the subscription. Sony already has some third party subs on PS4 and PS5 with Ubisoft + and EA Play so again a cutdown gamepass version could work.
 
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Tell you what, they'll miss a marketing trick if they announce Sea of Thieves on Switch without exclaiming the words 'RARE ARE BACK' at every opportunity.

Dardan Sandiego said:
Wonder if Spencer is gonna step down over this. If it's as radical a shift as these leaks seem to suggest they really need someone new to right the ship that Spencer failed to keep from sinking.
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Yeah Spencer still seemed pretty keen to keep the hardware side of Xbox going and was potentially looking to play the long game and come back strong next gen, but I wonder if those higher up don't have that same kind of patience.
 
I also feel this must be a recent decision. If this had been Microsoft's long term plan dating back the past few years, then they would have surely been blaring it from the rooftops during the ABK acquisition. It would have made it far less of an ordeal to get the deal past regulators if they'd made it clear this was going to be their plan going forward.

The more I think about it, the more it seems clear that the Microsoft Top Brass aren't happy with Xbox sales and are now looking to recoup costs from the ABK merger as fast as possible. Possible they now view dedicated hardware as an unnecessary expense in this day and age.
 
It really must have been a rather turnaround. I'd say plans/talks about such a move might've existed for a while, but it does feel like a "sudden execution" of the plans.

I mean, think of it. The whole ActiBlizz buyout drama, the court shit and everything, could've been avoided if it was already planned for them to pivot to only give their own games a timed exclusivity (if even that) but generally were to move to a "pseudo third party" to port everywhere if possible.
 
I haven't read everything about what's been going on here, but multiplat seems like the best strategy for Xbox with all its many studios whose revenue comes from multiplat games. Those companies would be slowly killed by Xbox exclusivity.

Totally agree with people saying a lack of competition for PS is really bad for players.

But am I allowed to laugh at huge money failing (in the console business)?
 
neil said:
I haven't read everything about what's been going on here, but multiplat seems like the best strategy for Xbox with all its many studios whose revenue comes from multiplat games. Those companies would be slowly killed by Xbox exclusivity.

Totally agree with people saying a lack of competition for PS is really bad for players.

But am I allowed to laugh at huge money failing (in the console business)?
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I sure don't find it funny for the people that invested in the Xbox ecosystem that may end up losing their digital library and game saves in the future due to MS pulling a Zune or a Windows Phone. But laugh away I guess.
 
Bill Gaitas said:
I sure don't find it funny for the people that invested in the Xbox ecosystem that may end up losing their digital library and game saves in the future due to MS pulling a Zune or a Windows Phone. But laugh away I guess.
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That isn't what I was laughing at and I don't see any quickening of that situation. It is an inevitable situation for all digital libraries you know.
 
Bill Gaitas said:
I sure don't find it funny for the people that invested in the Xbox ecosystem that may end up losing their digital library and game saves in the future due to MS pulling a Zune or a Windows Phone. But laugh away I guess.
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It's very catastrophist to think that the Xbox digital library will just vanish because of this. At this point, there's no solid reason to think that. If anything, Microsoft going digital-only and wanting to leverage their ecosystem over exclusive games signals the opposite.
 
Backwards compatibility and access to your library doesn't really matter if the games are only playable on future hardware that you have no reason to buy.
 
Maxrunner said:
Rare Replay switch(2)?
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Well, that was on XOne, so technically, i fail to see how you would need Switch 2 for that?

Buuuuuuuut ... you can and should expect that this change in strategy might affect current and new games first and for all, while older games might take some time to see ports.
 
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I doubt most of this happens. As much as I want to see Banjo come home, and as much as that Insomniac leak showed it's hard to make money in the AAA business, Xbox is still doing great with their current model. As of right now I'd say it's more likely we get a new Xbox than we get a PS6.

If they really do pull the plug, I wonder where that leaves Sony. They're already struggling to afford their current output, what happens if Gamepass eats their lunch on their own console?
 
Dardan Sandiego said:
Wonder if Spencer is gonna step down over this. If it's as radical a shift as these leaks seem to suggest they really need someone new to right the ship that Spencer failed to keep from sinking.
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Don’t know if that’ll be the case. But i did wonder about his role. This change seems to be too far soon compared to what he talked about and those leak emails.
 
Regulus Tera said:
All I really want is Rare Replay and Hi Fi Rush. To be honest the rest of the XBOX catalogue just bores me to tears.
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I'm 50/50 on it, but it honestly wouldn't surprise me if HiFi Rush was a Direct announcement of the upcoming one.

Starfield might be a MS-own announcement, or they allow Sony to use it in a State of Play or something.
 
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DecoReturns said:
Don’t know if that’ll be the case. But i did wonder about his role. This change seems to be too far soon compared to what he talked about and those leak emails.
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Seeing as Spencer was the one to make Bethesda games exclusive in the first place, I very much doubt that he was on board with this. Like, he might accept it if it's a condition for him to keep his job but I don't think they're doing this voluntarily.
 
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RochHoch said:
Remember when people were afraid that they might take COD away from Playstation

Starting to feel like the merger imight be helping Sony more than Microsoft lmao
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The exclusive CoD deals have been very important for PlayStation, and these will probably not continue.
 
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Galgavias said:
I also feel this must be a recent decision. If this had been Microsoft's long term plan dating back the past few years, then they would have surely been blaring it from the rooftops during the ABK acquisition. It would have made it far less of an ordeal to get the deal past regulators if they'd made it clear this was going to be their plan going forward.

The more I think about it, the more it seems clear that the Microsoft Top Brass aren't happy with Xbox sales and are now looking to recoup costs from the ABK merger as fast as possible. Possible they now view dedicated hardware as an unnecessary expense in this day and age.
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I agree with a lot that you say in this post. It's definitely a new decision, not something they've been planning long term.

I think one of the reasons we're seeing this is that tech companies like Microsoft were throwing money around when interest rates were cheap and debt was essentially free, but now that interest rates have skyrocketed, the financial departments are now going to be taking an axe to anything that doesn't generate revenue and profit.

The sad thing is, even with the above, I still think this is foolish short term thinking. Console hardware always has the potential to generate revenue long term. The best thing MS could have done would be putting in the effort to make Xbox hardware desirable again: doing that means getting billions in revenue from game sales on your hardware, which is a huge source of income. De-emphasizing hardware just means giving up on that revenue stream, which is absolutely the wrong decision. Not when they had the entire ABK library to start selling the hardware with.
 
Galgavias said:
Tell you what, they'll miss a marketing trick if they announce Sea of Thieves on Switch without exclaiming the words 'RARE ARE BACK' at every opportunity.


Yeah Spencer still seemed pretty keen to keep the hardware side of Xbox going and was potentially looking to play the long game and come back strong next gen, but I wonder if those higher up don't have that same kind of patience.
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The few people who care about such things, and care about what Rare was and did decades ago, probably know it anyway. It is not a helpful marketing gag.
 
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It is actually interesting. Cause looking back in 2022 they actually had both Starfield and Redfall as Xbox Console Exclusive in their communication during their 2022 showcase. Which wasn't used in the 2023 showcase. So perhaps during the ABK times they actually already were playing with this idea.
 
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The IP I was most worried about was Elder Scrolls, so I'm glad to learn that there's a chance I might be able to play the next one on my playstation or switch. I was ready to buy an Xbox only for that, but I rather not to.
 
JazzPotatoes said:
I agree with a lot that you say in this post. It's definitely a new decision, not something they've been planning long term.

I think one of the reasons we're seeing this is that tech companies like Microsoft were throwing money around when interest rates were cheap and debt was essentially free, but now that interest rates have skyrocketed, the financial departments are now going to be taking an axe to anything that doesn't generate revenue and profit.

The sad thing is, even with the above, I still think this is foolish short term thinking. Console hardware always has the potential to generate revenue long term. The best thing MS could have done would be putting in the effort to make Xbox hardware desirable again: doing that means getting billions in revenue from game sales on your hardware, which is a huge source of income. De-emphasizing hardware just means giving up on that revenue stream, which is absolutely the wrong decision. Not when they had the entire ABK library to start selling the hardware with.
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Replying mostly to the bolded part here: I think it made sense for them to at least wait and see if a massive exclusive like Starfield would turn into a system seller. I think it's safe to say that it did not and that, going even a step further, Microsoft so far does not have a single system seller exclusive to them.

Now I get that "system seller" may be a poorly defined term. What I mean is literally any piece of software that significantly shifts hardware numbers (making an impact on market share as well) and I don't think we can say that we have seen any of that so far.

In light of that I think it would make a lot of sense for Microsoft to make their content available to a broader audience, ultimately earning them more money.

But that of course both begs the question "why continue making dedicated hardware?" and also wether or not GamePass is really the way to go for them to make the most money from their IPs.
 
JazzPotatoes said:
I agree with a lot that you say in this post. It's definitely a new decision, not something they've been planning long term.

I think one of the reasons we're seeing this is that tech companies like Microsoft were throwing money around when interest rates were cheap and debt was essentially free, but now that interest rates have skyrocketed, the financial departments are now going to be taking an axe to anything that doesn't generate revenue and profit.

The sad thing is, even with the above, I still think this is foolish short term thinking. Console hardware always has the potential to generate revenue long term. The best thing MS could have done would be putting in the effort to make Xbox hardware desirable again: doing that means getting billions in revenue from game sales on your hardware, which is a huge source of income. De-emphasizing hardware just means giving up on that revenue stream, which is absolutely the wrong decision. Not when they had the entire ABK library to start selling the hardware with.
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I'm in agreement that it seems short sighted, and I believed until recently their strategy was to emulate what Nintendo achieved with the Wii U to Switch turnaround - ride out the next 2-3 years, giving all their new studios time to cook, then come out the gate with a new console and a killer lineup for the following two years. I think it's a strategy that could have worked if Phil had been given time. But I guess you could argue that Phil has been given six years and Xbox sales are worse than ever.

It can't be overstated just how Xbox sales have fallen off a cliff recently. I mean this holiday period should have been a triumphant return for them, with a big new exclusive, the completion of the ABK merger, and the price of the Series X being lowered in some places in the USA. Instead, it struggled to keep up with a Nintendo console that's 7 years old and likely has a successor coming this year. I suppose the higher ups must have been looking at this and decided enough was enough.

Imagine going back in time into the Wii U era and telling everyone that it would likely be Microsoft pulling out of the home console business in ten years, not Nintendo. Blimey those two really handed that gen to Sony on a silver platter.
 
maniacmaison said:
The IP I was most worried about was Elder Scrolls, so I'm glad to learn that there's a chance I might be able to play the next one on my playstation or switch. I was ready to buy an Xbox only for that, but I rather not to.
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There's a rumored remakster of Oblivion by Virtuos. Virtuos is a well experienced Switch port studio, so Oblivion for Switch and/or successor makes a lot of sense.
 
I just hope they come out and share what their immediate and mid-term plans are for the XBOX platform because I currently see no point in sticking with them rather than cut my "losses" and jump back to PS.
 
Dardan Sandiego said:
I just hope they come out and share what their immediate and mid-term plans are for the XBOX platform because I currently see no point in sticking with them rather than cut my "losses" and jump back to PS.
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For the upcoming time, i would expect MS own games having a short (~6 month) timed exclusivity on their own hardware/Gamepass.

But longer term, that might go away, too.
 
This shit really is crazy to see unfold. I've been itching to get the XSX for a while now, but finances always reared its ugly head and said "Nope!". I'm gonna sit back for a while and see what Microsoft has to say about all of this and what their plans are going forward, hardware-wise, before I make any decision.
 
cire said:
I know this seems like an over-generalization, but it's pretty astounding that the Xbox brand still continues to struggle to recover from the Xbox One.
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I mean, they'd probably be very happy with Xbox One sales right now...
 
Pillydillsy said:
You think something will come up to replace Xbox in the same way they replaced Sega once their consoles went under?
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No one's successfully broken into the traditional console space since Xbox did it over 20 years ago despite Xbox being a weak brand for half of that time, if not longer. If your goal is to just make a traditional PlayStation competitor, the only real play is to buy exclusivity deals until your first party output can rival Sony's.

And if that sounds close to what Xbox was doing, that's the problem; Microsoft arguably played things correctly from a strategy perspective (outside of whatever 2013 was...), they "just" fumbled the cultivation of their own game studios, and this is the result. Trying to break into this space is far too risky for most companies with not enough reward. The other tech giants (Google, Apple, Amazon) have all invested to some degree into the gaming space, and none of them have seen great returns. What's happening to the Xbox brand is likely seen not as an opportunity to enter the space, but an example of what happens if you do without much of a plan beyond throwing money at the industry - which is all any of those companies are in a position to do.

As others have mentioned, other platforms have taken Xbox's place; perhaps not in a traditional sense, but just as additional options to spend time/money on. PC has taken off quite a bit by this point, especially with the Steam Deck. The various PC options complement a PS5 far better than an Xbox at this point imo, and I know way more people that own a PS5 and dabble in PC than I know PS5/Xbox owners (in fact, I don't think I know an owner of a current Xbox console).
 
JazzPotatoes said:
The sad thing is, even with the above, I still think this is foolish short term thinking. Console hardware always has the potential to generate revenue long term. The best thing MS could have done would be putting in the effort to make Xbox hardware desirable again: doing that means getting billions in revenue from game sales on your hardware, which is a huge source of income. De-emphasizing hardware just means giving up on that revenue stream, which is absolutely the wrong decision. Not when they had the entire ABK library to start selling the hardware with.
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Consoles have and always will be a risk. You can go a whole generation of hardware with incredible games made obscure because they happen to be stuck on an unpopular machine. You can have you brand nigh irreverisbly damaged by such failure.

SEGA lost their hardware battle when Saturn was the epic disaster it was. Nintendo survived two flops thanks to their handheld sales and first party relevancy. Sony had to spend ridiculous amounts of money to save the PS3 and bring back good will for the PS4.

Series X marks a double flop from MS, and the potential for recreating the 360 just isn't enough for the execs who want to pull out now.
 
They bought some of the biggest third party studios ever, it makes a lot of sense to not lose the biggest part of their costumers, but they really need to explain the situation. At this moment we don't know if we should keep investing in this platform or not.

TanookiTom said:
"why continue making dedicated hardware?"
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This is the most important question, and I think Series S might be the answer. They can offer different options that don't really compete with PS, like a much cheaper console that runs most games, handheld gaming devices, super powerful Xbox/Surface gaming PC, etc.
 
TanookiTom said:
Replying mostly to the bolded part here: I think it made sense for them to at least wait and see if a massive exclusive like Starfield would turn into a system seller. I think it's safe to say that it did not and that, going even a step further, Microsoft so far does not have a single system seller exclusive to them.

Now I get that "system seller" may be a poorly defined term. What I mean is literally any piece of software that significantly shifts hardware numbers (making an impact on market share as well) and I don't think we can say that we have seen any of that so far.

In light of that I think it would make a lot of sense for Microsoft to make their content available to a broader audience, ultimately earning them more money.

But that of course both begs the question "why continue making dedicated hardware?" and also wether or not GamePass is really the way to go for them to make the most money from their IPs.
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The thing is, Starfield was never going to turn things around by itself. No one game ever turns around hardware by itself. It's about showcasing that you've got an upcoming library of strong software.

Following on from Starfield, MS were setting things up to show off Indiana Jones, Avowed, Hellblade II, etc. And now out of nowhere, after already advertising these games as must have Xbox games, the messaging is now pivoting to "Oh yeah, these are going to be on other platforms too."

To compare, if Nintendo had taken this approach, then the release of Mario Kart 8 on Wii U would be the point at which they announced they're packing in making hardware.
 
Really glad I stopped investing in the Xbox ecosystem around the time Persona 5/Nier Automata came out, and Scalebound got cancelled.
 
Dark Cloud said:
Banjo Threeie in name is great. But please remember Rare made those games. Their humor is so hard to match. That’s a vital part of the Banjo Kazooie series. If Rare doesn’t make Banjo Threeie (which they won’t), then I’ll have some skepticism
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I thought most of the original Rare devs who worked on Banjo left to create Playtonic?

In a sense, Yooka-Laylee is Banjo-Threeie.

9-Volt said:
Not by Rare but Too Human is also like that. Started as a GameCube game, it was a part of GCN's pre-release lineup. They released the unfinished game on 360, yet I wouldn't say no to a Switch port. It wasn't THAT bad.
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I was super hyped for Too Human. Then it came out and got middling reviews and I never picked it up. I think I might have played a demo, though.
 
9-Volt said:
Not by Rare but Too Human is also like that. Started as a GameCube game, it was a part of GCN's pre-release lineup. They released the unfinished game on 360, yet I wouldn't say no to a Switch port. It wasn't THAT bad.
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that shit is in legal superhell, you will never see a switch port of it because they can't sell it
 
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