StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

[Zedark]

you dont kill your golden goose, until your other production proven to be profitable.

The golden goose won't look like a golden goose in the next holiday if there truly is nothing big releasing for it this year, though. They either have made the choice to transition to Switch 2 or are keeping the Switch alive, at the cost of Switch 2 software momentum. And the current scenario looks like the former is the case to me. And in that case, the marketing of Switch 2 takes precedence over giving a system with no specific software to sell its room to sell I'd think.

 

[PandaAndino]

200 posts is alot . im more a lurker than a poster. 100 should be enough.

 

[Hermii]

The golden goose won't look like a golden goose in the next holiday if there truly is nothing big releasing for it this year, though. They either have made the choice to transition to Switch 2 or are keeping the Switch alive, at the cost of Switch 2 software momentum. And the current scenario looks like the former is the case to me. And in that case, the marketing of Switch 2 takes precedence over giving a system with no specific software to sell its room to sell I'd think.

I think there's about 50% chance they'll release prime 4 this year, even if the original plan was cross gen.

 

[Zedark]

I think there's about 50% chance they'll release prime 4 this year, even if the original plan was cross gen.

That's possible, but the point about no big games releasing still stands

 

[Steve]

They either have made the choice to transition to Switch 2 or are keeping the Switch alive, at the cost of Switch 2 software momentum.

Furukawa realising he's can't fuck up the easiest transition in gaming history.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

you dont kill your golden goose, until your other production proven to be profitable.

I guess they're in a bad place if they can't announce the successor until the successor is proven to be profitable.

 

[Darknut85]

200 posts is alot . im more a lurker than a poster. 100 should be enough.

50 posts to go and you‘ll discover the deepest secrets of famiboards.

 

[omniryu]

Speed is more important than capacity.

I mean I guess. But I rather have an optical disc that has the whole game instead if thr limited space what Blu ray has. I don't mind the install time. If taken care of. It can last a long time.

All I need is leaks or rumours from GDC about triple A/graphically demanding games being developed for the Switch NG, and I won't have to worry too much about all the hardware details.

There already are rumors of such games.

 

[Steve]

There already are rumors of such games.

The only games that we know/expect are
Elden ring
16 new atlus/sega games that we'll be getting in the next couple of years
FF7, but not the game, they just tested it on the switch 2 Dev kit and said it ran similar to a ps5 dev kit.
The next resident evils games plus Re4 remake
And it's been rumored that platinum will release a trilogy pack of Bayonetta for the switch 2
and lastly the new monster hunter game, because Monster hunter and Nintendo mix pretty well together.
These are the only one that i know of.

 

[Bonejack]

The only games that we know/expect are
Elden ring
16 new atlus/sega games that we'll be getting in the next couple of years
FF7, but not the game, they just tested it on the switch 2 Dev kit and said it ran similar to a ps5 dev kit.
The next resident evils games plus Re4 remake
And it's been rumored that platinum will release a trilogy pack of Bayonetta for the switch 2
and lastly the new monster hunter game, because Monster hunter and Nintendo mix pretty well together.
These are the only one that i know of.

If Visions of Mana isn't a launch game of Switch 2, then whoever made this decision needs to go and look for another job.

 

[LiC]

200 posts is alot . im more a lurker than a poster. 100 should be enough.

That post was a rumor that has nothing whatsoever to do with Nintendo, or even video games in general, FYI.

 

[KeijiKG]

NX2 is not the codename.

Don't care, it's a good shorthand.

 

[Darknut85]

Don't care, it's a good shorthand.

NG or S2 are even shorter, though.

 

[KeijiKG]

NG or S2 are even shorter.

Thing about acronyms that the internet in general seems to miss is that a lot of them can overlap for multiple things (take for instance "AC" can refer to either air conditioning, Animal Crossing or Assassin's Creed just for starters). It's not just important for being being the shortest but it helps not to be common with something else.

Offhand I'd either think of "Ninja Gaiden" or "Season 2" on NG and S2 at first glance without context but NX2, I just think the second generation of Nintendo NX.

 

[Darknut85]

Thing about acronyms that the internet in general seems to miss is that a lot of them can overlap for multiple things (take for instance "AC" can refer to either air conditioning, Animal Crossing or Assassin's Creed just for starters). It's not just important for being being the shortest but it helps not to be common with something else.

Offhand I'd either think of "Ninja Gaiden" or "Season 2" on NG and S2 at first glance without context but NX2, I just think the second generation of Nintendo NX.

Good argument, even though in this thread you don’t really have the risk to be mistaken.

 

[omniryu]

The only games that we know/expect are
Elden ring
16 new atlus/sega games that we'll be getting in the next couple of years
FF7, but not the game, they just tested it on the switch 2 Dev kit and said it ran similar to a ps5 dev kit.
The next resident evils games plus Re4 remake
And it's been rumored that platinum will release a trilogy pack of Bayonetta for the switch 2
and lastly the new monster hunter game, because Monster hunter and Nintendo mix pretty well together.
These are the only one that i know of.

I believe Ubisoft has some games. I might be wrong but I think Far Cry 7 is one of those games. Not going to lie.... I just can never get into Far Cry.

Edit: link:

Far Cry 7 Will Reportedly Be Called Far Cry: Rise and Launch on Nintendo Switch 2

Here's everything we know about Far Cry 7, including its release date, story setting, and more.

afkgaming.com

 

[Steve]

I believe Ubisoft has some games. I might be wrong but I think Far Cry 7 is one of those games. Not going to lie.... I just can never get into Far Cry.

Edit: link:

Far Cry 7 Will Reportedly Be Called Far Cry: Rise and Launch on Nintendo Switch 2

Here's everything we know about Far Cry 7, including its release date, story setting, and more.

afkgaming.com

Makes sense Ubisoft are gonna be the first, third party developer to port their games on the switch 2, like the new prince of Persia game was developed for the switch and were the biggest third party studio of the switch first year.

The most likely contenders for a switch 2 port is rainbow 6 siege and all of the far cry games.

 

[seyfeselassie]

I was banking on FF7 remake trilogy eventually making it to the Switch NG, until I heard about the console exclusivity. Assuming the Switch NG could run it, I think it would sell pretty well. Squeenix could focus on a PC and Switch NG release, since apparently the PS5 debut for FF7 Rebirth sold much less than expected.

 

[fguzramm]

Thing about acronyms that the internet in general seems to miss is that a lot of them can overlap for multiple things (take for instance "AC" can refer to either air conditioning, Animal Crossing or Assassin's Creed just for starters). It's not just important for being being the shortest but it helps not to be common with something else.

Offhand I'd either think of "Ninja Gaiden" or "Season 2" on NG and S2 at first glance without context but NX2, I just think the second generation of Nintendo NX.

Everytime I read something about animal crossing and I see AC, the first thing that comes to mind is assassin's creed XD

 

[theguy]

The most likely contenders for a switch 2 port is rainbow 6 siege and all of the far cry games.

the latest Assassins Creed games too

 

[Hermii]

Makes sense Ubisoft are gonna be the first, third party developer to port their games on the switch 2, like the new prince of Persia game was developed for the switch and were the biggest third party studio of the switch first year.

The most likely contenders for a switch 2 port is rainbow 6 siege and all of the far cry games.

¨Taking it with some salt.

 

[bmfrosty]

NG or S2 are even shorter, though.

S2 is a hell of an engine.

 

[kvetcha]

S2 is a hell of an engine.

 

[Lancelot]

Furukawa realising he's can't fuck up the easiest transition in gaming history.

It's not really the easiest, there's a lot at stake here. No fallback console, iterative concept, same form factor and only more power... The four horsemen of transition risks for Nintendo.

 

[Hermii]

It's not really the easiest, there's a lot at stake here. No fallback console, iterative concept, same form factor and only more power... The four horsemen of transition risks for Nintendo.

Probably why they don't dear to launch without a solid lineup.

 

[Mendinso]

I was banking on FF7 remake trilogy eventually making it to the Switch NG, until I heard about the console exclusivity. Assuming the Switch NG could run it, I think it would sell pretty well. Squeenix could focus on a PC and Switch NG release, since apparently the PS5 debut for FF7 Rebirth sold much less than expected.

For what it's worth, it would appear there was some misinformation on the article and doesn't sound like it's a full exclusivity. Plus, hell of a thing to say "Console exclusive till x day", if that was indeed the case.

Now, as to whether or not Square Enix will actually push for ports to the next generation hardware for Switch...

¯\(ツ)/¯

 

[LinkURL]

For what it's worth, it would appear there was some misinformation on the article and doesn't sound like it's a full exclusivity. Plus, hell of a thing to say "Console exclusive till x day", if that was indeed the case.

Now, as to whether or not Square Enix will actually push for ports to the next generation hardware for Switch...

¯\(ツ)/¯

Yes, I really doubt that the trilogy will remain exclusive to Sony for long, I even think it's likely that we'll see ports before the third part to build the hype.

 

[ILikeFeet]

another interesting UE5 use case on Series S. uses Lumen and Nanite on all systems and every mode



in graphics and performance mode, resolution is between 806x454 and 1280x720. trends trends to the higher and lower end depending on the mode.

no system can lock at 60fps, but 30fps is good and evenly paced

we know Epic is working on mobile Lumen, so I expect Lumen, on the low end, to get better over time

 

[Tentacle-tropes]

If Visions of Mana isn't a launch game of Switch 2, then whoever made this decision needs to go and look for another job.

Frankly that would be pretty on brand for SE & certain 3rd parties in general

 

[Dekuman]

It's not really the easiest, there's a lot at stake here. No fallback console, iterative concept, same form factor and only more power... The four horsemen of transition risks for Nintendo.

Not having a fallback isn't exactly the worst thing. When PS3 failed out of the gate, Sony basically spent an entire genration of profits to recuperate it granted Sony itself has other lines of business they could draw on, but back then gaming was their top earning division so it's about as close to being a one product company in that regards

Nintendo's equivalent would be its massive warchest which will certainly allow them to invest in the existing underperforming console and tide them through to a successor.

And I suspect in that scenario we'd see them launch other side products to supplement their income. So it's not necessarily all or nothing.

 

[redmutineer75]

Not having a fallback isn't exactly the worst thing. When PS3 failed out of the gate, Sony basically spent an entire genration of profits to recuperate it granted Sony itself has other lines of business they could draw on, but back then gaming was their top earning division so it's about as close to being a one product company in that regards

Nintendo's equivalent would be its massive warchest which will certainly allow them to invest in the existing underperforming console and tide them through to a successor.

And I suspect in that scenario we'd see them launch other side products to supplement their income. So it's not necessarily all or nothing.

There was also the PSP

 

[Brofield]

Not having a fallback isn't exactly the worst thing. When PS3 failed out of the gate, Sony basically spent an entire genration of profits to recuperate it granted Sony itself has other lines of business they could draw on, but back then gaming was their top earning division so it's about as close to being a one product company in that regards

Nintendo's equivalent would be its massive warchest which will certainly allow them to invest in the existing underperforming console and tide them through to a successor.

And I suspect in that scenario we'd see them launch other side products to supplement their income. So it's not necessarily all or nothing.

At last, N64 and Gamecube mini!

 

[oldpuck]

Not having a fallback isn't exactly the worst thing. When PS3 failed out of the gate, Sony basically spent an entire genration of profits to recuperate it granted Sony itself has other lines of business they could draw on, but back then gaming was their top earning division so it's about as close to being a one product company in that regards

Sony's worst PS3 year was the launch year, and they still earned 63 billion dollars, over 3x the amount of money that Nintendo earned in peak Wii (2009, 18 billion).

Sony Pictures is one of the Big 5 movie studios, Sony Music Group is one of the Big Three music labels. Being the top earning division is not the same as being the majority of revenue, when you have so many divisions. Gaming is, even today, only a third of Sony's revenue.

Nintendo's equivalent would be its massive warchest which will certainly allow them to invest in the existing underperforming console and tide them through to a successor.

And I suspect in that scenario we'd see them launch other side products to supplement their income. So it's not necessarily all or nothing.

This is probably true. Nintendo couldn't take two "failed" consoles in a row, but they could take one. But even the 3DS did alright. I'm not sure a successor console in the same formfactor is gonna be a problem for them, their handheld division never had a Wii U/GameCube situation.

 

[redmutineer75]

Sony's worst PS3 year was the launch year, and they still earned 63 billion dollars, over 3x the amount of money that Nintendo earned in peak Wii (2009, 18 billion).

Sony Pictures is one of the Big 5 movie studios, Sony Music Group is one of the Big Three music labels. Being the top earning division is not the same as being the majority of revenue, when you have so many divisions. Gaming is, even today, only a third of Sony's revenue.


This is probably true. Nintendo couldn't take two "failed" consoles in a row, but they could take one. But even the 3DS did alright. I'm not sure a successor console in the same formfactor is gonna be a problem for them, their handheld division never had a Wii U/GameCube situation.

If we want to get technical, the handheld division did have the Virtual Boy, but that wasn't really treated as the "next generation" in the same way the aforementioned consoles were.

 

[Thomson20994]

Well, T239 is also evaluated for automotive customers....

Makes sense considering the first time the Tegra X1 was shown off to the public it was in a car infotainment system at CES 2015 demonstrating it's automotive capabilities.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

If we want to get technical, the handheld division did have the Virtual Boy, but that wasn't really treated as the "next generation" in the same way the aforementioned consoles were.

This is true. The handheld division did not really produce anything noteworthy from 1994 to 1998, with the Virtual Boy failing and Project Atlantis going nowhere, plus Yokoi leaving the company. In hindsight, had they avoided losing time with Atlantis, they could have released the Game Boy Color 1-2 years earlier. They were at least savvy enough to avoid releasing Atlantis in its state.

 

[Hermii]

Makes sense considering the first time the Tegra X1 was shown off to the public it was in a car infotainment system at CES 2015 demonstrating its automotive capabilities.

You would think T239 is a bit overpowered for infotainment.

 

[TLZ]

The Codename has to be "Link", 'cause Nintendo refuses to talk.

 

[karmitt]

It's not really the easiest, there's a lot at stake here. No fallback console, iterative concept, same form factor and only more power... The four horsemen of transition risks for Nintendo.

Edit: This feels like it belongs in the other thread so hiding:

 

[Dakhil]

if Nintendo paid for the development of the chip or is guaranteeing certain volumes as part of their agreement with nvidia, i would imagine one of the clauses would be non compete by nvidia from selling it to a competitor, and Microsoft, is a competitor.

The scenario where Microsoft uses this chip can only happen I imagine if this was the plan all along (which to me seems unlikely) or Switch 2 crashes and burns so hard Nintendo can't hold up its end of the bargain and nvidia needs to find customers of unsold T239s.

I want to warn everyone the following post is long, although I try to make the post easier to read despite the length.

Just to be clear, I believe the highest binned T239s are automatically exclusive to Nintendo.

Anyway, to play devil's advocate, outside of a hypothetical Nvidia Shield TV, where else could Nvidia use lower binned T239s? Definitely not Jetson since Nvidia's already using T234 for Jetson Orin, from a higher binned T234 for Jetson AGX Orin to a lower binned T234 for Jetson Orin Nano.

Assuming Nintendo and Nvidia are using TSMC's 4N process node to fabricate T239, I have no doubt that TSMC's 4N process node has much better yields than Samsung's 8N process node. But I think obtaining 100% yields is impossible for any advanced process node. And although I have no doubt that TSMC's 4N process node has >80% yields, which is what TSMC initially obtained with TSMC's N5 process node, I imagine the yields for TSMC's 4N process node is a far cry from being close to 100% yields. So having defective dies is inevitable.

The reason why I mention yields is because Nvidia explicitly said that T239 has 8 CPU cores in one cluster, and NVN2 said that GA10F, the GPU inside T239, has 12 SMs. And since NVN2's the API, that implies that all 12 SMs are active. So I imagine Nintendo needs ≥90% yields and the highest binned T239s, especially if Nintendo requires the CPU to run at the same frequency in both handheld mode and TV mode, similar with the Nintendo Switch, especially with scaling down the CPU frequency being much more difficult to do vs scaling down the GPU frequency. Although I don't expect Nintendo to have the CPU and GPU frequencies be aggressively high, frequencies still play a nontrivial role in terms of yields. And I imagine Nintendo wants the CPU and GPU to run at the frequencies Nintendo set in a very consistent manner.

So due to those requirements, I don't think Nintendo really has any use for lower binned T239s. And I can see Nintendo having exclusivity with the highest binned T239s, with Nvidia being free to use the lower binned T239s that don't meet Nintendo's requirements in any way Nvidia chooses, in Nintendo's agreement with Nvidia.

Although I have no doubt Microsoft's a competitor to Nintendo in the video game industry, I don't really think Windows 12 Arm based laptops hypothetically speaking are really competing with Nintendo's new hardware, since Windows 12 Arm based laptops are general purpose products that can probably play some video games here or there, whereas Nintendo's new hardware's designed specifically for playing video games. And I don't think Windows 12 Arm based laptop sell enough to warrant having a surplus of lower binned T239s.

 

[Pokemaniac]

Here‘s something which may be interesting for future consoles (and handhelds):

A 3D nanoscale optical disk memory with petabit capacity - Nature

Optical nanoscale disk memory with petabit-level capacity is developed by extending the recording architecture to three dimensions with hundreds of layers, and exabit-level storage can be achieved by stacking the disks into arrays.

www.nature.com

Optical storage and handhelds don't really complement each other well, for all the obvious reasons (power consumption, moving parts, physical size, etc.). It doesn't seem especially likely that we'll ever see another optical based handheld again after the PSP sort of demonstrated why it doesn't work super well.

 

[Steve]

For the next hardware, what are some stupid gimmick/wish list that you want on the switch 2. that's seems unlikely Here's mine

1. You can insert cartridges on the dock so you can put 3 games in it and let it kinda feel like it's digital, something similar like pikmin 1-2 physical

2. The switch is backward compatibility to all the switch controllers via bluetooth, like you can still use the joy con and pro controller and the only difference is
that the joycon isn't compatible on handheld because of the 8 inch screen.

3. Better motion control/gyro aiming on controllers, i'm one of the few people who actually think it's really fun and cool to use.

4. The switch dock supports 120 fps on certain games, like Mario wonders and older gen games.

5. Having a mini pencil included on the switch 2, something like the Wii U in which you can draw.

6. having mii verse would go hard https://www.neogaf.com/threads/anyone-remember-miiverse.1648217/

That's are some that i could think of, would like hearing yours, when it comes to hardware or selling points.

 

[VagrantValmar]

Optical storage and handhelds don't really complement each other well, for all the obvious reasons (power consumption, moving parts, physical size, etc.). It doesn't seem especially likely that we'll ever see another optical based handheld again after the PSP sort of demonstrated why it doesn't work super well.

Dropping by just to say

Fuck UMDs

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

another interesting UE5 use case on Series S. uses Lumen and Nanite on all systems and every mode



in graphics and performance mode, resolution is between 806x454 and 1280x720. trends trends to the higher and lower end depending on the mode.

no system can lock at 60fps, but 30fps is good and evenly paced

we know Epic is working on mobile Lumen, so I expect Lumen, on the low end, to get better over time

Inconsistent 720p/locked 30 FPS on the Series S with Lumen is not really fantastic at all for Switch 2 implications, I guess we'll see in the future.

 

[karmitt]

For the next hardware, what are some stupid gimmick/wish list that you want on the switch 2. that's seems unlikely Here's mine

1. You can insert cartridges on the dock so you can put 3 games in it and let it kinda feel like it's digital, something similar like pikmin 1-2 physical

2. The switch is backward compatibility to all the switch controllers via bluetooth, like you can still use the joy con and pro controller and the only difference is
that the joycon isn't compatible on handheld because of the 8 inch screen.

3. Better motion control/gyro aiming on controllers, i'm one of the few people who actually think it's really fun and cool to use.

4. The switch dock supports 120 fps on certain games, like Mario wonders and older gen games.

5. Having a mini pencil included on the switch 2, something like the Wii U in which you can draw.

6. having mii verse would go hard https://www.neogaf.com/threads/anyone-remember-miiverse.1648217/

That's are some that i could think of, would like hearing yours, when it comes to hardware or selling points.

Mine continues to be that asymmetrical gameplay is enabled via one player using the handheld system, and everybody else using the TV with Joycons. I wouldn’t expect whatever is streamed to the TV in this scenario would be more than 1080p but that’s fine.

I just think Nintendo can do more things with that style of play, and it wasn’t well utilized on Wii U. The main reason I wouldn’t want this to happen is if the mechanism to wirelessly stream from the console > dock is expensive. I don’t want them to be carving out anything meaningful to standard experiences to keep costs down.

 

[Dekuman]

I'm beginning to think the Switch2 gimmick will be something that takes advantage of the tensor cores in the system.
Maybe some sort of AI based UI/assistant? AR with the camera etc.

 

[bmfrosty]

For the next hardware, what are some stupid gimmick/wish list that you want on the switch 2. that's seems unlikely Here's mine

1. You can insert cartridges on the dock so you can put 3 games in it and let it kinda feel like it's digital, something similar like pikmin 1-2 physical

2. The switch is backward compatibility to all the switch controllers via bluetooth, like you can still use the joy con and pro controller and the only difference is
that the joycon isn't compatible on handheld because of the 8 inch screen.

3. Better motion control/gyro aiming on controllers, i'm one of the few people who actually think it's really fun and cool to use.

4. The switch dock supports 120 fps on certain games, like Mario wonders and older gen games.

5. Having a mini pencil included on the switch 2, something like the Wii U in which you can draw.

6. having mii verse would go hard https://www.neogaf.com/threads/anyone-remember-miiverse.1648217/

That's are some that i could think of, would like hearing yours, when it comes to hardware or selling points.

I agree with #2, but not with anything else.

1) Edge case
3) I don't know that there's a way forward for this without a camera/sensor bar type setup. Feels like a lot of complication, not that I wouldn't welcome it for full Wii BC (via eShop).
4) Edge case
5) Capacitive stylus pens exist. Easy to pick up something 3rd party if you want that extra precision feel.
6) This was part of the slowness of the Wii U. I think that Nintendo is deeply going to keep away from anything that slows the UI.

Mine continues to be that asymmetrical gameplay is enabled via one player using the handheld system, and everybody else using the TV with Joycons. I wouldn’t expect whatever is streamed to the TV in this scenario would be more than 1080p but that’s fine.

I just think Nintendo can do more things with that style of play, and it wasn’t well utilized on Wii U. The main reason I wouldn’t want this to happen is if the mechanism to wirelessly stream from the console > dock is expensive. I don’t want them to be carving out anything meaningful to standard experiences to keep costs down.

I have a concept for this. It's a joycon mount that would allow joycons to do this - https://a.co/d/7BFnl8z - why this would be interesting to me is that it has no electrical components so it should be inexpensive enough to sell for $20 or have it as a pack-in replacement for the grip. There would be almost zero hardware cost to add to the S2 itself as it would just be a streaming app that could return back location touches. Would be easy to work with a phone or a tablet. Just needs IOS and Android apps.

 

[ILikeFeet]

Inconsistent 720p/locked 30 FPS on the Series S with Lumen is not really fantastic at all for Switch 2 implications, I guess we'll see in the future.

lumen has been shown running on weaker hardware, so they are working on scaling it further down. I think we'll see something in a couple weeks

You would think T239 is a bit overpowered for infotainment.

gotta run Unreal Engine smoothly. seriously

 

[omniryu]

I'm beginning to think the Switch2 gimmick will be something that takes advantage of the tensor cores in the system.
Maybe some sort of AI based UI/assistant? AR with the camera etc.

An AI THERAPIST! I think I need help coping on the lack of Mega Man legend collection news....

 

[Steve]

What's everyone's opinion on motion controls here, like in my opinion it's one of the most comfortable way to aim, i'm saying this because how cool it is in Botw and Metroid prime remastered and resident evil 4 on the Wii.

And how would y'all feel if Nintendo somehow made it better for the switch 2