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Discussion You've been tasked with ensuring that future generations have access to Nintendo's DS, 3DS, Wii and Wii U games. How do you go about it?

Dardan Sandiego

Dardan Sandiego

Dill Spowser's Nephew
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As you probably know, Nintendo has announced that they will shut down the 3DS and Wii U eShops in little over a year. After "late March 2023" it will not be possible to buy digital games from these two platforms, leaving people only the option to track down physical copies (if available) or play pirated copies on hacked hardware or a PC through emulation. Understandably, many of us are not happy about this. Since Nintendo has also stopped manufacturing the hardware, it indirectly also affects DS and Wii games. While large portions of those libraries are available through other means, the availability of certain games or specific content will be severely hampered. So I came up with a fun thought experiment to distract us from the fact that everything will die one day.

Furukawa himself has approached you with a simple task: Make sure that Nintendo's 3DS and Wii U games can still be played on present and future Nintendo hardware.

Here's the "rules":
  • You don't have to come up with a one-size-fits-all solution. As I said, this should be fun so you can also focus on a single tiny DSiWare game if you want to. Even better if you come up with ways to improve the original!
  • For simplicity's sake, we're going to assume that future Nintendo hardware will be similar to the Nintendo Switch and have the same interface, meaning a hybrid device with one touch screen and detachable motion controllers. Feel free to come up with peripherals but keep accessibility in mind (unlike Nintendo).
  • The way you bring these games and content to modern hardware is up to you but it has to be a suitable replacement for the original game. Meaning, if you wanna bring Nintendo Land over to new hardware, you cannot jettison its asymmetric multiplayer.
  • You have an "unlimited" budget for anything pertaining to software. Meaning, it can be emulation, a remaster, a remake, an "Ultimate" sequel that incorporates previous games, DLC for existing games etc. You can even come up with additional content or new modes. Anything goes as long as it's close enough to the game within reason. A city builder conversion of A Link Between Worlds doesn't count, for example.
  • If you say something akin to "we can let that game die" to Mr. Furukawa, he will send the Nintendo ninjas after you.
If you need inspiration, here's a handy list of all Nintendo-published games:

List of Nintendo products - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
Make them all available on the Switch eShop but you can only play DS and 3DS games in table top mode with that stand that people use for shmups.

Bam.
 
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Don't close the eshops.

Quite frankly, that's the only way to truly preserve access to the games. No matter how good any other commercial solution is, a huge chunk of the library will be gone and never come back once the digital stores close

I know it's against the rules set out by the op but that's my other answer. We would need another dual screen device (that can ideally stream to a TV) and powerful enough to play Wii U games. You still have to not close the stores though
 
if I knew the answer I'd be working for nintendo

I think with Wii/Wii U, HD remasters for Switch is the way to do.

For DS/3DS, I dunno, use the FlipGrip/equivalent
 
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They skipped mini consoles like GB/C, GBA, N64, NGC…

But they can do a Nintendo DS mini* but well, its size would be the same as DS Lite model but with 20 nintendo games pre-loaded

1) Super Mario 64 DS
2) Wario Ware Touched
3) Animal Crossing Wild World
4) Mario Kart DS
5) Nintendogs
6) New Super Mario Bros
7) Brain Age
8) Big Brain Academy
9) Rhythm Heaven
10) Kirby: Squeak Squad
11) Metroid Prime Hunters
12) Zelda Phantom Hourglass
13) Tetris DS
14) Yoshis Island DS
15) Clubhouse Games
16) Planet Puzzle League
17) Elite Beat Agents
18) Advance Wars Days of Ruin
19) Mario & Luigi RPG 3
20) Golden Sun Dark Dusk

Any of the last 3 can be replaced with Fire Emblem
 
In a future Switch console, it would be able to be undocked and still communicate with the dock to display an image on the TV, basically acting as a Wii U gamepad type situation. That should also help to emulate DS and 3DS as you have two screens and one of them is a touch screen. Joycons already take care of the Wii situation.
 
Dardan Sandiego said:
Make sure that Nintendo's 3DS and Wii U games can still be played on present and future Nintendo hardware.
Click to expand...
given this specific phrasing, there are only two feasible options:

create hardware powerful enough to emulate the systems effectively, with local switch connectivity replacing the gamepad and a "flip grip" display replacing the 3DS dual-screens

or

produce the 3DS and Wii U hardware in perpetuity
 
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Release DS/3DS/etc. Classic Mini consoles in the future for low(ish) prices with access to the games through online connections?
No clue how feasible this would be, like at all, but I don't care!
 
Here is how I make Nintendo a lot of money and keep these games available and mostly playable in their original state. You know how you can set up switches next to each other for the tank game in clubhouse games or for super Mario party mini games? You make the DS/3DS/Wii U games that really rely on dual screen and touch require TWO switches to play and force those games to only be played like that. Any other games (mainly 3DS) that don’t need the second screen or touch get full price remasters.
 
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Imitatio said:
Wait, so it has to include Switch and forward? Can't be separate from the hybrid line, that is?
Booo. Hmmm.
Click to expand...
yeah, without technical knowledge like JIT approaches and processor registers this is a very narrow discussion

I for one am not knowledgeable enough about emulation to approach it lol
 
Imitatio said:
Wait, so it has to include Switch and forward? Can't be separate from the hybrid line, that is?
Booo. Hmmm.
Click to expand...

Raccoon said:
yeah, without technical knowledge like JIT approaches and processor registers this is a very narrow discussion

I for one am not knowledgeable enough about emulation to approach it lol
Click to expand...

The "restriction" is in place mostly to make people think about how to overcome the difference in interfaces rather than a technical deep dive in how to emulate 3DS games on a Switch.
 
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You know those foldable screens that I think Samsung has been using for phones and tablets recently? The next Switch screen could use that. And the detachable joy-cons would also be foldable. The stylus would be stored in the top.
 
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Emulation with plenty of options, different ones which are set as the default for different games.

For DS/3DS games it's easy to stick two screens of content on one rectangle, but the optimal scaling/orientation is going to differ. Touch content is still usable by touch screen, or approximated by gyro aim when docked.

Wii U, in most cases making the gamepad screen one that's transparently shown on top of the main screen but can be toggled on/off would work half decently for most single-player games, anyway. For those who really want to get hardcore, connecting two Switches and using one as the GamePad screen would do almost everything.

One problem all of the above doesn't touch is that all the camera/mic stuff needs another accessory because they didn't spent a dollar putting them on Switch.
 
I gather every single one of them up, physically and lock them in a vault, while removing all digital traces of these games, so no one has the old copies, and their are no digital copies anywhere.

I hire 8 literal Adonis's and Amazon's to be my gladiator champions. Just peak human specimens.

I create a massive fortress/obstacle course and have my champions each man a station, atop a gauntlet, raining nerf foam balls and missiles from ridiculous contraptions down below.

Once a year I allow 10 contestants to run my rad mountain, to gamble my gauntlets.

They must run each of my champions gauntlets without getting hit by nerf balls or missiles, and then challenge each of the champions themselves to a gladiator duel, like being on top of platforms over water and knocking each other off with giant q tips.

Upon besting all 8 of my champions and their gauntlets and arriving to me at the top of my mountain, I release all to the public domain for everyone and for all time.
 
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KC Hazel said:
In a future Switch console, it would be able to be undocked and still communicate with the dock to display an image on the TV, basically acting as a Wii U gamepad type situation. That should also help to emulate DS and 3DS as you have two screens and one of them is a touch screen. Joycons already take care of the Wii situation.
Click to expand...
Joycons don't take care of Wii. Without the infrared sensor bar Wii games on Switch use Gyro to simulate Infrared aiming but to be frank it is a massively inferior replacement. Gyro works well for games like Skyward Sword where it needs to, for instance, know the relation of some object to your body or to make small adjustments to other aiming methods such as dual stick aiming but it is trash for aiming at a position on screen. I cannot play the All-Stars version of Galaxy for instance.

Of course the easy solution would be including an infrared sensor bar and its port on the next version of the dock.
 
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crepuscule said:
Joycons don't take care of Wii. Without the infrared sensor bar Wii games on Switch use Gyro to simulate Infrared aiming but to be frank it is a massively inferior replacement. I cannot play the All Stars version of Galaxy.

Of course the easy solution would be including an infrared sensor bar and it's port on the next version of the dock.
Click to expand...
I misread this at first as the IR blasters being in the dock and honestly I think that would be an elegant solution if technically feasible

one would of course have to leave line of sight with the dock and specify its location relative to the display, which complicates the setup

honestly I'd prefer we either embrace gyro or start using cameras that can detect the displays themselves
 
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Ideally cloud gaming could be a solution. For the second screen, using a dedicated app in your smartphone should be enough for traditional inventory management like WWHD and TPHD, but I understand it could become a problem in games with more involved uses of the Wii U Gamepad, albeit all smartphones have gyroscopes and cameras.
 
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crepuscule said:
Joycons don't take care of Wii. Without the infrared sensor bar Wii games on Switch use Gyro to simulate Infrared aiming but to be frank it is a massively inferior replacement. Gyro works well for games like Skyward Sword where it needs to, for instance, know the relation of some object to your body or to make small adjustments to other aiming methods such as dual stick aiming but it is trash for aiming at a position on screen. I cannot play the All-Stars version of Galaxy for instance.

Of course the easy solution would be including an infrared sensor bar and it's port on the next version of the dock.
Click to expand...
I thought gyro worked really well for Galaxy, but sure, it is an inferior method. I'm cool with including a sensor bar.
 
I don't care for the sensor bar because of how it would complicate a simple setup

gyro with a pointer ought to be enough
 
Release a Switch model which includes a receiver similar to what is in the Wii U GamePad so that with two Switch units you can emulate Wii U functionality.

There's nothing technically stopping the use of Wiimotes on the Switch. They're just bluetooth controllers at the end of the day and the sensor bar does not need to be connected to the system, but it does need power - there are plenty of existing options out there for this. They could also include a sensor bar at the top of the screen like the GamePad has but then you'd unleash the wrath of bezel haters.

for DS and 3DS? …Not sure
 
Raccoon said:
I don't care for the sensor bar because of how it would complicate a simple setup

gyro with a pointer ought to be enough
Click to expand...
You could have options. Include the port on the dock but sell the sensor bar seperately and have the option to use gyro to emulate infrared. But yeah without infrared aiming you aren't emulating Wii good enough for me.
 
crepuscule said:
You could have options. Include the port on the dock but sell the sensor bar seperately. But yeah without infrared aiming you aren't emulating Wii good enough for me.
Click to expand...

If you're going to resell the sensor bar, you might as well just make it USB powered at this point, rather than changing the docks. (And this may be necessary anyway to meet EU law standards now)
 
For DS/3DS it’s simple. Do it like the Wii U did it.

In handheld, have the top and bottom screens side by side, and since for many games bottom screen was just extra info or a map or inventory, Have the main screen display on the Switch, press a button, and it goes to the bottom screen.

You can use touch control to select items or program it so the dpad or stick acts like a cursor to select something.

Bam.
 
Clix said:
For DS/3DS it’s simple. Do it like the Wii U did it.

In handheld, have the top and bottom screens side by side, and since for many games bottom screen was just extra info or a map or inventory, Have the main screen display on the Switch, press a button, and it goes to the bottom screen.

You can use touch control to select items or program it so the dpad or stick acts like a cursor to select something.

Bam.
Click to expand...

Also release a special DS/3DS controller similar to the NES/SNES/N64/Genesis ones, except in this case it's just the bottom half of the system with the touchscreen and microphone and what not. Something like:

93b15ee98aba6ca9730a562f303bacd1.png


A perfect and elegant solution, no doubt
 
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Skittzo said:
Easiest way would be to open a PC storefront for all Nintendo published games on shops that have closed.
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you've gotta read the OP man, it specifies that it has to be on switch and all future hardware

otherwise though I like this idea, though they'd still have to develop emulators. on the other hand, LEGO acquired the standard aftermarket digital design tool a few years ago. maybe Nintendo should acquire dolphin lmao
 
Skittzo said:
Easiest way would be to open a PC storefront for all Nintendo published games on shops that have closed.
Click to expand...
That doesn't really work for these games. It works fine for older ones or Wii / Wii U games with just button controls but Motion control and touch screens don't translate that well to just keyboard and mouse or a normal controller
 
I'd pump a lot of money in NSO, make all games of all Nintendo systems (including Wii U and 3DS) available in various tiers of subscriptions. That would be the start, and from there i work on getting all games playable that were built for the dual screen, touch controls or gamepad stuff.

Basic sub (Silver) €20: Everything up to GBC/N64
Gold tier €40: everything up to GCN/NDS, including some third party systems, like pc engine, Mega Drive etc. I'd strike a deal with those third parties to get their games there, even if it means rotating games.
Platinum tier €60: Everything up to Wii U/3DS, including Dreamcast. Also includes many DLC bundles from first party games.

After that I make sure games are put on the service on a more regular basis. And I'd add the option to buy the games on the service.

DS games will be playable by holding the Switch vertically in handheld mode or tabletop mode, an official stand will be released for tabletop, and a controller with a holder for handheld mode. They're available for 50% off when subscribing for a year worth of Gold subscription or higher.

For docked you can use the Switch app on a smartphone to emulate the second screen or have the screen on your TV similar to how some emulators work. You can use gyro to simulate touch control.

For Wii U, you can also use the app to simulate the gamepad screen. You can get a holder, which attaches to your Switch and any smartphone, and can be used for any game that needs 2 screens. Also available for 50% for platinum tier subscribers.

For Wii games that need accurate pointer controls new joy-cons will be released. They will be the standard controller for the next system and include IR pointers in front like the Wii.

The joy-cons have analogue triggers, better sticks, HD rumble 2.0, slightly larger buttons, proper d-pad. The Switch itself works as a sensor bar for tabletop mode, but a standard sensor bar is included with each system.

Some games may be playable without the second screen/pointer solution, but some require them. Every game will show the requirements for it.
 
Raccoon said:
you've gotta read the OP man, it specifies that it has to be on switch and all future hardware

otherwise though I like this idea, though they'd still have to develop emulators. on the other hand, LEGO acquired the standard aftermarket digital design tool a few years ago. maybe Nintendo should acquire dolphin lmao
Click to expand...
Oh whoops, I thought I did read it fully. Must have missed something.

EDIT: Ah I read the "rules" but missed the header before the rules.
astrogamer said:
That doesn't really work for these games. It works fine for older ones or Wii / Wii U games with just button controls but Motion control and touch screens don't translate that well to just keyboard and mouse or a normal controller
Click to expand...
They could come up with a Wiimote PC adapter pretty easily. They'd need some kind of touch pad though, yeah.
 
Include DS and 3DS games in NSO (or put them on the eShop if there'd be no return on investment that route) and remaster/remake the remaining key Wii/Wii U titles.
 
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Dardan Sandiego said:
What do you mean?
Click to expand...
Basically a Nintendo "Retro Game Store" on PC, like Steam but for Nintendo games. And only "retro" games, meaning only games where you can no longer buy the original hardware or buy the software on the hardware's storefront.

But that is against the rules, so I withdraw that suggestion.
 
Skittzo said:
Basically a Nintendo "Retro Game Store" on PC, like Steam but for Nintendo games. And only "retro" games, meaning only games where you can no longer buy the original hardware or buy the software on the hardware's storefront.

But that is against the rules, so I withdraw that suggestion.
Click to expand...

Ah, gotcha. Yeah, I wasn't really thinking about Nintendo distributing their games outside of their own ecosystem. As I said before, the aim was mainly for people to think about different ways on how to adapt games with wildly different interfaces. Not that I mind other discussions.
 
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Most DS and 3DS games aren't going to be preserved by Nintendo. That's just how it's going to be and there's not really all that much that can be done to salvage things, in a way that makes any realistic business sense.

Nintendo's goal needs to be making sure everything from Switch and beyond moves forward. And they should add GB, GBC, GBA, GCN, and Wii software to NSO in the future.
 
Beard said:
Most DS and 3DS games aren't going to be preserved by Nintendo. That's just how it's going to be and there's not really all that much that can be done to salvage things, in a way that makes any realistic business sense.
Click to expand...
Not asking for financially viable solutions!
 
Beard said:
Most DS and 3DS games aren't going to be preserved by Nintendo. That's just how it's going to be and there's not really all that much that can be done to salvage things, in a way that makes any realistic business sense.

Nintendo's goal needs to be making sure everything from Switch and beyond moves forward. And they should add GB, GBC, GBA, GCN, and Wii software to NSO in the future.
Click to expand...
a good universal emulator could get close!
 
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Make all two screen games playable for people who have two switches with a fancy and unwieldy dock.
 
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I'm of the opinion that Nintendo should be putting as many of their old games from the Wii era backwards on their modern day systems as possible. They've got access to perhaps the best back catalogue in gaming, I don't see any point sitting on these old games in the hope that one day time might be right for a remake. They can become the go-to console of choice for retro enthusiasts if they create a comprehensive catalogue of old games, from their consoles and beyond.

DS and 3DS are tricky for sure. Maaaaaybe an appy which allows you to have one screen on your TV and the touchscreen on the Switch itself, but seems an awful faff
 
Beard said:
I....don't even know what they'd do that makes sense in that scenario, outside of just keeping the old eShops open or releasing some digital-only dual screen system with a new eShop exclusively for legacy software.
Click to expand...

I think JoshuaJSlone's suggestion is the best "universal" solution that covers most games:

JoshuaJSlone said:
Emulation with plenty of options, different ones which are set as the default for different games.

For DS/3DS games it's easy to stick two screens of content on one rectangle, but the optimal scaling/orientation is going to differ. Touch content is still usable by touch screen, or approximated by gyro aim when docked.

Wii U, in most cases making the gamepad screen one that's transparently shown on top of the main screen but can be toggled on/off would work half decently for most single-player games, anyway. For those who really want to get hardcore, connecting two Switches and using one as the GamePad screen would do almost everything.

One problem all of the above doesn't touch is that all the camera/mic stuff needs another accessory because they didn't spent a dollar putting them on Switch.
Click to expand...

But as I wrote in the OP, there's no need to overthink it. I'm not terribly concerned with the logistics of this, more with ideas on how to make these games playable on modern Nintendo hardware. Like, if you think the best way to make Phantom Hourglass playable on the Switch (or Switch 2) is a full 3D remake in the style of Wind Waker I'd like to read why and what it'd be like.
 
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Release a second screen accessory that plugs via USB to whatever version of the Switch is out at the moment, and allows to be used as the touchscreen on the 3DS/Gamepad on WiiU. It comes with a 3DS/DS card reader and a disk drive, and can be linked to a Nintendo account to download any digital content. The rest is emulated on the Switch itself (With the accessory including some of the more exotic hardware to help with it)

Crusters said:
I gather every single one of them up, physically and lock them in a vault, while removing all digital traces of these games, so no one has the old copies, and their are no digital copies anywhere.

I hire 8 literal Adonis's and Amazon's to be my gladiator champions. Just peak human specimens.

I create a massive fortress/obstacle course and have my champions each man a station, atop a gauntlet, raining nerf foam balls and missiles from ridiculous contraptions down below.

Once a year I allow 10 contestants to run my rad mountain, to gamble my gauntlets.

They must run each of my champions gauntlets without getting hit by nerf balls or missiles, and then challenge each of the champions themselves to a gladiator duel, like being on top of platforms over water and knocking each other off with giant q tips.

Upon besting all 8 of my champions and their gauntlets and arriving to me at the top of my mountain, I release all to the public domain for everyone and for all time.
Click to expand...

Which Megaman game is this?
 
Tangerine_Cookie said:
Release a second screen accessory that plugs via USB to whatever version of the Switch is out at the moment, and allows to be used as the touchscreen on the 3DS/Gamepad on WiiU. It comes with a 3DS/DS card reader and a disk drive, and can be linked to a Nintendo account to download any digital content. The rest is emulated on the Switch itself (With the accessory including some of the more exotic hardware to help with it)



Which Megaman game is this?
Click to expand...

 
Nintendo DS:

Add the games to the Nintendo Switch Online Expansion Pack. The games are small enough in file size to warrant a downloadable collection of ROMS, and can't be improved much without a full-scale remake. The games would only be playable in handheld mode, with the games being displayed in "split-screen" (basically how it worked playing DS games on the Wii U gamepad only).

Nintendo 3DS:

Remaster the games completely. Miitopia proved that these games are modern enough that with some model and texture upgrades, can be on par with Switch original titles. Obviously, this would require some effort, but if we have an unlimited budget in this scenario, I'd go for it. For any games that absolutely require the dual-screen (even though there were significantly fewer of them on 3DS compared to the OG iirc), just use my DS online app solution.

Wii:

Remaster the games. This already seems to be their strategy (Super Mario Galaxy in 3D All-Stars, Skyward Sword HD, Xenoblade DX), so they may as well continue this way. The games still look and play great with texture upgrades and model improvements. The Joy-Con are more than capable of replicating any motion control gameplay.

Wii U:

This is simple, just finish porting the library. As for any games that only work with the gamepad/asymmetrical gameplay (Nintendo Land, Game & Wario), they would require a second Switch.
 
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1) Add every Nintendo system to NSO. Charge monthly money for access ( Codename Nintendoflix). Add the games time after time ( but faster than they do now).

2) Do a NintendoRetro Console that is specifically designed for NSO- Access, maybe even to download some of the games.

3) Release Nintendo Mini Consoles for Collectors in special Editions like SNES Mini, GBMini, WiiMini, etc...

Thank you for your attention.
 
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I put them in a subscription service which expands only at a glacial pace, without options to remap controls, and don't provide any option to purchase the games.

laughs
 
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flipgrip4-fs8.png

I think the Flip Grip would allow you to play the majority of 3DS titles in hand-held mode. Maybe DS titles as well, but I'm honestly not sure how the touch sensitivity compares. But most of the 3DS games I've played treat the bottom screen as a map/menu/extra buttons and don't require precision touch sensitivity.
 
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ship-water.gif


(Just kidding. I don't get why Nintendo doesn't let me pay a monthly sub fee for a compendium of their own first-party games that don't need extensive re-working like the Wii or DS/3DS games that might need it. Just throw up the ROMs and take my fifteen bucks a month already. I know it's surely not that simple, but it's kinda maybe simple like that, maybe? I would still pay for the remakes, too! They could have my fifteen bucks for Link's Awakening or Majora's Mask and then sixty bucks apiece for the remakes!)
 
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