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StarTopic Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty | Featuring Lu Bu and the Cao Cao Crew

RIGHT, I forgot about that part of it! You’ll see the icon light up and make a sound bit of course it’s pretty easy to not notice the UI when you’re In The Shit

A bunch of my “I’m alone and can sit by myself and play Wo Long” time has fallen through this weekend so far, determined to get back to it. Anyone who has gotten past that poisony area under the capital, any pointers on it are welcome 🙏
I just beat the poison zone not long ago, it kinda sucks! KT being like "okay, what if we made a poison swamp, but instead of health it drains your stamina so every single hit staggers you! HA, take that, From!"

My advice is to do a lot of run-and-gun. Do a lot of plunging attacks from above on the snake ladies and such, get a kill, then just run the hell away so you don't get stuck in the swamp. Try some stealth, too, if you have much of that.
 
I just beat the poison zone not long ago, it kinda sucks! KT being like "okay, what if we made a poison swamp, but instead of health it drains your stamina so every single hit staggers you! HA, take that, From!"

My advice is to do a lot of run-and-gun. Do a lot of plunging attacks from above on the snake ladies and such, get a kill, then just run the hell away so you don't get stuck in the swamp. Try some stealth, too, if you have much of that.
Thank you for the tips! For about half a second when I entered the area I thought, “Oh, it doesn’t take any health to be in this stuff!”

Half a second later: “Oh. OH. You don’t get any spirit in there, eh” 😄

I knew a trickier map was coming up sooner or later. My stealth stat is pretty high so I will try and work that in more for sure. I haven’t been getting too many backstabs here but I’m sure with a better route I’ll be in business!
 
Thank you for the tips! For about half a second when I entered the area I thought, “Oh, it doesn’t take any health to be in this stuff!”

Half a second later: “Oh. OH. You don’t get any spirit in there, eh” 😄

I knew a trickier map was coming up sooner or later. My stealth stat is pretty high so I will try and work that in more for sure. I haven’t been getting too many backstabs here but I’m sure with a better route I’ll be in business!
One thing I'm wondering is if there's a way to dampen your sound in this like in Nioh. The invisibility spell isn't all that useful if the enemy still hears you before you can backstab them anyway. I love doing a ninja/speed/assassin build like that
 
One thing I'm wondering is if there's a way to dampen your sound in this like in Nioh. The invisibility spell isn't all that useful if the enemy still hears you before you can backstab them anyway. I love doing a ninja/speed/assassin build like that
Put even more points into Water if you want to be able to sneak around.

The other thing is just holding block while sneaking, as that seems to be a much better means for controlling your walking speed than merely relying on the control stick.
 
Played this a lot today, overall I’m quite liking it but I don’t think it’s going to live up to Nioh 2 in the end. But that’s okay! Nioh 2 is a phenomenal game and I appreciate that they tried to do something a bit different.

The bosses have been pretty hit and miss, honestly mostly miss or at least medium. I just fought the usual “gigantic monster thing” boss that Nioh has done before and it wasn’t great, although at least it wasn’t too difficult. However, the previous boss of the snow battlefield Lu Bu was great and probably the best boss in the game so far, he was tough but really enjoyable and fun.

Probably my least favorite thing so far is the loot; I don’t like that they took away the levels on items and made upgrading at the blacksmith the most important thing. Because it feels like you very rarely get actual upgrades anymore - you still get tons of garbage loot drops, but you don’t get much of the “ooh, shiny!” feeling you got from a super cool weapon drop or something in Nioh.
 
Just got done with the Lu Bu rematch and man that was a cool way to do it. This game rules.

Edit: Managed to one shot the final boss and roll credits. That was pretty nifty.
 
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Ultimate strat for any boss:

I3vk1dn.gif
 
Did the first mission again on "NG+" to see what that's about. You have to actually finish the first boss fight's second phase so I decided to see if I could get it damageless. Managed to do it in a few tries. The numbers don't seem tuned that much higher, but it's just enough that I could see it stacking up to some pretty tough fights later.
 
I'm not really into Souls-likes, but this looks cool.
I would say this is one of the least Souls-y games of this type that I've played, so if you're more into action games like Ninja Gaiden this is closer to that than Souls IMO. Nioh was already kind of half Souls half more straight action, and this game pushes it even further.
 
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Finally, got to play this. Played the first level and sub chapters and was fun. Is there a penalty going two phaases? Like I know they contradict each other, like is going Wood and Metal a bad idea? Also is there anyway to change weapon scaling, I am going Dual Blades and so far it looks like I have to dump my points in Wood and Water as Dual Blades tend to favor those phases...which is fine but I wasnt all that interested in Water.

Lastly, is there a respecc? If so how do I access?
 
Been playing some this afternoon. Got past where I was! But I admit I’m starting to worry a little about my chances for finishing this game lol
 
Finally, got to play this. Played the first level and sub chapters and was fun. Is there a penalty going two phaases? Like I know they contradict each other, like is going Wood and Metal a bad idea? Also is there anyway to change weapon scaling, I am going Dual Blades and so far it looks like I have to dump my points in Wood and Water as Dual Blades tend to favor those phases...which is fine but I wasnt all that interested in Water.

Lastly, is there a respecc? If so how do I access?
You unlock free respecs around Mission 5 I believe, they’re very easy to do so don’t worry too much about that.

As for weapon scaling, I’ve found that you don’t need to focus too much on any one stat as the scaling doesn’t seem THAT good (maybe that changes by late endgame). It seems to be kind of like Nioh in that putting around 10-20 points into most or all stats gives you a lot of benefits across the board before the stat gains start slowing down.
 
🤯
Holy shit, that is genius. I will be doing that from now on!
Another thing to add, thanks to a tip on reddit: you can hold block while jumping, too!

Makes you more mobile for those annoying targets that are just a step or two from turning around!
Played this a lot today, overall I’m quite liking it but I don’t think it’s going to live up to Nioh 2 in the end. But that’s okay! Nioh 2 is a phenomenal game and I appreciate that they tried to do something a bit different.
As much as I'm enjoying the game, too, I get a similar vibe. Even compared to Strangers of Paradise (which even has a similar "deflect" mechanism), the combat complexity and depth just doesn't feel as robust. Doesn't help that a lot of the weapons feel "same-y", and we're back to Nioh 1 levels of enemy type diversity, too.

At times, it really comes off as if this game was something that Yasuda and Team Ninja wanted to make sure they had something out for the 2023 calendar year, while Rise of the Ronin (which he's back in the director's chair again for the first time since Nioh 2!) will be the "true evolution of the Team Ninja masocore formula". Which I don't intrinsically have a problem with, but it does make me concerned if Team Ninja is stretching themselves out with this rigorous schedule.

But I digress. Again, it's not like buying and enjoying these games, anyway!
 
Won’t lie: spending an hour and a half on a boss without much to show for it sorta stinks 😂 Gonna retreat and try a few side missions I guess…
 
Won’t lie: spending an hour and a half on a boss without much to show for it sorta stinks 😂 Gonna retreat and try a few side missions I guess…
Lu Bu? He's definitely tough, the one thing that helped me with him is that once you learn all his moves he's pretty repetitive and it just comes down to going through a few cycles of breaking him. But he does have a lot of health and it took me a while to beat him, too. Easily the most times I've had to repeat a boss so far in this game.
 
This triple duel side mission is crazy. It doesn’t feel like the camera/lock-on is well suited to fighting three people at once anyway, and then they put you in an arena with slowing mud AND give all three enemies some kind of ranged attack to interrupt you at the exact wrong times. Not a fan.
 
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Now that I've sat on it for a bit and down the sidequests and some NG+, definitely feel like I have some kind of take to put out on the game. I think it's pretty good, and I really like how simple it is to get into and understand the goals of the combat system. I ended up liking the morale system by the end because the dynamic difficulty is just a feel good power fantasy that also gives a way for people to "grind out" levels without just cramming their faces into bosses. Even dying isn't super punishing with that system and I like the online vengeance gimmick. I think the thing I most appreciated about it was the dedication to fast, flying combat that matches the inspiration and source material. Just performing basic parry sequences where you try to squeeze in hits between step cancelling leads to the frenetic movement I want from a Wuxia action game.



It's so sick that playing well turns it into this type of choreography, and I really appreciate that there's more to do than just wait for parry windows since damage and spirit building mess with that risk reward. The spirit gauge in particular is a super fun way to replace the stamina bar as the risk/reward/punishment structure. It encourages you to be active and precise, and adds a layer of punishment for getting too sloppy with the step/dodge button. Doing a cool sequence then cashing out at the correct times to stagger a boss in like 10 seconds is a primo ass feeling.

But then the game just doesn't do enough with what I've played. The lacking enemy variety and the somewhat repeating movesets are kind of a bummer by the late game. Boss behavior is never really aggro in a way to be punishing to things like spirit management or bad movement. I checked and I one shot over 3/4 of the bosses in the game, and nothing took more than a handful of tries to figure out. I don't really care that the game is "easy"(difficulty is a weird fucking notion anyways), I just wish it pushed me a bit more to think about spirit management and finding holes in patterns. Instead, I often got caught in a loop of just learning how to parry lord a couple of strings and winning off of fishing for critical parries. Maybe some more variance to punish this habit and more rewards for using spirit in different ways would go a long way to fixing that repetition being so successful. I did find a lot of fun in trying to get the "perfect run" of bosses though, because you can end most of them in under a minute, and again it looks sick as all hell to do so it's satisfying. I want more pushes and rewarding feelings for challenging bosses in that way, since I found the real fun in keeping up those extended sequences. Atm they fall over a little too quickly when you find that rhythm.

So like, I found the game really fun to push mastery and consistency in to fulfill the cool action game fantasy despite how simple it is. I can also appreciate the step back from trying to be a game about solving combat systems (Nioh) and is just trying to to be more kinetic and simple to understand. There's just this feeling that there's more fun to be had pushing that system further for the crazies who want more out of it. Feels like Nioh all over again, where the first one was pretty solid and the sequel just went crazy with trying to deliver on that promise. This is begging for that sequel/DLC.

Can't stress enough that I really like the game and will def play more NG+ and DLC though. Shit rules. Just feel like it plays it too safe in some spots and loses out on some of the crazy potential I can see in it. Also, drop the loot system already. It doesn't hurt this game but it's so superficial this time I forgot about it until the end of this post.
 
Now that I've sat on it for a bit and down the sidequests and some NG+, definitely feel like I have some kind of take to put out on the game. I think it's pretty good, and I really like how simple it is to get into and understand the goals of the combat system. I ended up liking the morale system by the end because the dynamic difficulty is just a feel good power fantasy that also gives a way for people to "grind out" levels without just cramming their faces into bosses. Even dying isn't super punishing with that system and I like the online vengeance gimmick. I think the thing I most appreciated about it was the dedication to fast, flying combat that matches the inspiration and source material. Just performing basic parry sequences where you try to squeeze in hits between step cancelling leads to the frenetic movement I want from a Wuxia action game.



It's so sick that playing well turns it into this type of choreography, and I really appreciate that there's more to do than just wait for parry windows since damage and spirit building mess with that risk reward. The spirit gauge in particular is a super fun way to replace the stamina bar as the risk/reward/punishment structure. It encourages you to be active and precise, and adds a layer of punishment for getting too sloppy with the step/dodge button. Doing a cool sequence then cashing out at the correct times to stagger a boss in like 10 seconds is a primo ass feeling.

But then the game just doesn't do enough with what I've played. The lacking enemy variety and the somewhat repeating movesets are kind of a bummer by the late game. Boss behavior is never really aggro in a way to be punishing to things like spirit management or bad movement. I checked and I one shot over 3/4 of the bosses in the game, and nothing took more than a handful of tries to figure out. I don't really care that the game is "easy"(difficulty is a weird fucking notion anyways), I just wish it pushed me a bit more to think about spirit management and finding holes in patterns. Instead, I often got caught in a loop of just learning how to parry lord a couple of strings and winning off of fishing for critical parries. Maybe some more variance to punish this habit and more rewards for using spirit in different ways would go a long way to fixing that repetition being so successful. I did find a lot of fun in trying to get the "perfect run" of bosses though, because you can end most of them in under a minute, and again it looks sick as all hell to do so it's satisfying. I want more pushes and rewarding feelings for challenging bosses in that way, since I found the real fun in keeping up those extended sequences. Atm they fall over a little too quickly when you find that rhythm.

So like, I found the game really fun to push mastery and consistency in to fulfill the cool action game fantasy despite how simple it is. I can also appreciate the step back from trying to be a game about solving combat systems (Nioh) and is just trying to to be more kinetic and simple to understand. There's just this feeling that there's more fun to be had pushing that system further for the crazies who want more out of it. Feels like Nioh all over again, where the first one was pretty solid and the sequel just went crazy with trying to deliver on that promise. This is begging for that sequel/DLC.

Can't stress enough that I really like the game and will def play more NG+ and DLC though. Shit rules. Just feel like it plays it too safe in some spots and loses out on some of the crazy potential I can see in it. Also, drop the loot system already. It doesn't hurt this game but it's so superficial this time I forgot about it until the end of this post.

I'm only around 2/3 through the game, but I agree with a lot of this, maybe a bit lower on it overall than you. My biggest three complaints are:

1) Like you said, the loot. Despite there being too much of it in Nioh, it works well there due to how good it feels to get better gear/upgrades/etc.; essentially, the 'Diablo' effect of getting tons of shiny loot and having some of it be great, and also allow tons of customization and options. In Wo Long, it feels like you just get slightly different versions of exactly the same crap the entire game and it rarely feels good to get new loot. The 2 Star Belt Hook you find in Mission 10 can be exactly the same as the 2 Star Belt Hook in Mission 2, and that's just not interesting or much fun. Just ditch the loot system completely, or go all in on it like Nioh.

2) The environments/levels just don't feel all that interesting to me. Nioh 2 suffered from this to some degree, but I find it much worse here: Far too many open battlefields or similar-looking castles and not enough really unique areas and different spins on locations. And the level design in general I just don't tend to like nearly as much.

3) Bosses are a mixed bag, and often fall into the "it's a giant monster thing that's hard to read but you can mostly just kind of mash your way through it and be fine". It's not that they're too easy, maybe, like you were saying, but they're too... well, they don't push you enough to learn their attacks and patterns or do things differently. Some, like Lu Bu, I really enjoyed, but that's more the exception than the rule.

4) I miss hunting down Kodama, they are awesome
 
I'm only around 2/3 through the game, but I agree with a lot of this, maybe a bit lower on it overall than you. My biggest three complaints are:

1) Like you said, the loot. Despite there being too much of it in Nioh, it works well there due to how good it feels to get better gear/upgrades/etc.; essentially, the 'Diablo' effect of getting tons of shiny loot and having some of it be great, and also allow tons of customization and options. In Wo Long, it feels like you just get slightly different versions of exactly the same crap the entire game and it rarely feels good to get new loot. The 2 Star Belt Hook you find in Mission 10 can be exactly the same as the 2 Star Belt Hook in Mission 2, and that's just not interesting or much fun. Just ditch the loot system completely, or go all in on it like Nioh.

2) The environments/levels just don't feel all that interesting to me. Nioh 2 suffered from this to some degree, but I find it much worse here: Far too many open battlefields or similar-looking castles and not enough really unique areas and different spins on locations. And the level design in general I just don't tend to like nearly as much.

3) Bosses are a mixed bag, and often fall into the "it's a giant monster thing that's hard to read but you can mostly just kind of mash your way through it and be fine". It's not that they're too easy, maybe, like you were saying, but they're too... well, they don't push you enough to learn their attacks and patterns or do things differently. Some, like Lu Bu, I really enjoyed, but that's more the exception than the rule.

4) I miss hunting down Kodama, they are awesome
1) didn't bother me as much as I basically just tuned it out and treated this like an action game with slight customization. Just kept throwing on and upgrading 4 star gear and forgot about it.

2) I actually kinda liked some of the different aesthetics, but yeah it's repetitive and the level design is what I would call just inoffensive. I liked the change to Three Kingdoms stuff and the verticality, and I didn't mind hopping around a bit to find flags. I think the fact that planting a flag resets your "flasks" and HP without resetting the level meant I kinda blew through them and didn't get too hung up on it. I mostly just cleared them all out without ever resting and then if I missed flags the shortcuts were generous enough I could go back and find them in minutes.

I really was having so much fun trying to speed through as many encounters as possible I guess it didn't affect me as much. Your first 2 points kind of melted away the more I just treated this like a linear action gauntlet more than an ARPG. Makes me wonder if they should've just leaned into that harder by making faster levels and cutting the loot significantly, or instead just go full Nioh on it instead of this weird dialed back thing.

Out of the recent-ish Nioh/Souls esque things (SoP, Nioh 2, ER, Sekiro) this is probably the one I'm the least high on tbh. That is a string of real bangers though, and I'm just happy to have something that leans this hard into fluid action and fast fights. This one is doing something a bit different with that faster paced and honestly cinematic lean without giving up too much of the good action game sauce. There some missteps in the levels and even combat design(camera, targeting, enemy placement like to just break, wait until a certain boss fight for hilarious motion sickness), but I'm still pretty happy with over the top sequences of weaving attacks and parries together to not worry about it.

I'm with you 100% on point 4
 
I'm only around 2/3 through the game, but I agree with a lot of this, maybe a bit lower on it overall than you. My biggest three complaints are:

1) Like you said, the loot. Despite there being too much of it in Nioh, it works well there due to how good it feels to get better gear/upgrades/etc.; essentially, the 'Diablo' effect of getting tons of shiny loot and having some of it be great, and also allow tons of customization and options. In Wo Long, it feels like you just get slightly different versions of exactly the same crap the entire game and it rarely feels good to get new loot. The 2 Star Belt Hook you find in Mission 10 can be exactly the same as the 2 Star Belt Hook in Mission 2, and that's just not interesting or much fun. Just ditch the loot system completely, or go all in on it like Nioh.

2) The environments/levels just don't feel all that interesting to me. Nioh 2 suffered from this to some degree, but I find it much worse here: Far too many open battlefields or similar-looking castles and not enough really unique areas and different spins on locations. And the level design in general I just don't tend to like nearly as much.

3) Bosses are a mixed bag, and often fall into the "it's a giant monster thing that's hard to read but you can mostly just kind of mash your way through it and be fine". It's not that they're too easy, maybe, like you were saying, but they're too... well, they don't push you enough to learn their attacks and patterns or do things differently. Some, like Lu Bu, I really enjoyed, but that's more the exception than the rule.

4) I miss hunting down Kodama, they are awesome
The environments feeling like open battlefields kind of reminded me of playing DW, but instead of a musou encounter with famous characters, we have them in masocore boss fights. At least I thought of it like that for those areas.
 
Was able to play for another stretch this morning and...I couldn't do it! I can't beat Lu Bu. My best guess is the health factor, as @SammyJ9 mentioned above. I just can't keep the rally going quite long enough to come out on top. It doesn't feel insurmountable in the moment, but my countless attempts are kinda telling me otherwise. Now that I've tried for several hours to no avail, I think I might just move on. It's a shame, because I really like the setting and atmosphere and hangoutitude of Wo Long. But toward the end of my attempts today I legitimately started to feel kind of mad...at a video game. And that is the dumbest, most embarrassing response to have to a video game!
 
I haven't played in a couple of days but I'm proud of this clip.



Honestly playing more like Ninja Gaiden (with a bit of Sekiro) than a typical Souls games make me enjoy more the game.
 
1) didn't bother me as much as I basically just tuned it out and treated this like an action game with slight customization. Just kept throwing on and upgrading 4 star gear and forgot about it.

2) I actually kinda liked some of the different aesthetics, but yeah it's repetitive and the level design is what I would call just inoffensive. I liked the change to Three Kingdoms stuff and the verticality, and I didn't mind hopping around a bit to find flags. I think the fact that planting a flag resets your "flasks" and HP without resetting the level meant I kinda blew through them and didn't get too hung up on it. I mostly just cleared them all out without ever resting and then if I missed flags the shortcuts were generous enough I could go back and find them in minutes.

I really was having so much fun trying to speed through as many encounters as possible I guess it didn't affect me as much. Your first 2 points kind of melted away the more I just treated this like a linear action gauntlet more than an ARPG. Makes me wonder if they should've just leaned into that harder by making faster levels and cutting the loot significantly, or instead just go full Nioh on it instead of this weird dialed back thing.

Out of the recent-ish Nioh/Souls esque things (SoP, Nioh 2, ER, Sekiro) this is probably the one I'm the least high on tbh. That is a string of real bangers though, and I'm just happy to have something that leans this hard into fluid action and fast fights. This one is doing something a bit different with that faster paced and honestly cinematic lean without giving up too much of the good action game sauce. There some missteps in the levels and even combat design(camera, targeting, enemy placement like to just break, wait until a certain boss fight for hilarious motion sickness), but I'm still pretty happy with over the top sequences of weaving attacks and parries together to not worry about it.

I'm with you 100% on point 4
I think that's the big takeaway from this game for me: It kind of feels like it would be better served as a pure linear action combat-heavy game rather than leaning more into the ARPG elements, which are already pared down from Nioh as it is. And like you said, it's not bad at all, just a bit lower down than those other games for me - although I still need to play SOP, it's on my backlog.
 
Was able to play for another stretch this morning and...I couldn't do it! I can't beat Lu Bu. My best guess is the health factor, as @SammyJ9 mentioned above. I just can't keep the rally going quite long enough to come out on top. It doesn't feel insurmountable in the moment, but my countless attempts are kinda telling me otherwise. Now that I've tried for several hours to no avail, I think I might just move on. It's a shame, because I really like the setting and atmosphere and hangoutitude of Wo Long. But toward the end of my attempts today I legitimately started to feel kind of mad...at a video game. And that is the dumbest, most embarrassing response to have to a video game!
Frustration happens man, nothing to worry about. Idk how much of this genre or other more hardcore action games you've played, but if you do get the headspace to try again I'd encourage to toss a few runs just trying to feel out some of the timings or strategies. Getting "good" at this kind of game involves a lot of patience and just chilling out looking for patterns to exploit. In Lu Bu's case, he has some longer strings you might want to be careful about getting too risky with if you're not confident, and he has crits where if you successfully deflect you get to do normal attack > spirit for free (always is a max spirit hit).
 
Frustration happens man, nothing to worry about. Idk how much of this genre or other more hardcore action games you've played, but if you do get the headspace to try again I'd encourage to toss a few runs just trying to feel out some of the timings or strategies. Getting "good" at this kind of game involves a lot of patience and just chilling out looking for patterns to exploit. In Lu Bu's case, he has some longer strings you might want to be careful about getting too risky with if you're not confident, and he has crits where if you successfully deflect you get to do normal attack > spirit for free (always is a max spirit hit).

Maybe I’ll get back to it after a break. Still have it installed. But I spent probably like 3 hours trying to beat him! I tried to change up my approach, although how successful I was in doing that is definitely up for debate

I’ve played some of these types of games before and realized it’s kind of been a years-long trend for me.
 
I gotta say, my boy Zhiang Liang is a hell of an intro boss. Think I died on him five or six times, which is more than an intro boss has gotten me in a game like this, since... God, I don't know, Uncle Murai? And that was a long, long time ago

Not too bad once you take the time to learn him, but taking damage through block and taking full damage if you get your parry wrong... intense stuff

And his attack timings, oof. Man. That second phase doesn't swing much but does hit like a train

Good intro! Good intro
 
I gotta say, my boy Zhiang Liang is a hell of an intro boss. Think I died on him five or six times, which is more than an intro boss has gotten me in a game like this, since... God, I don't know, Uncle Murai? And that was a long, long time ago

Not too bad once you take the time to learn him, but taking damage through block and taking full damage if you get your parry wrong... intense stuff

And his attack timings, oof. Man. That second phase doesn't swing much but does hit like a train

Good intro! Good intro
I was really curious to get a good look at this guy because he's talked about a lot, so on NG+ I sat around looking at his moveset and did a quick no hit run of him. I think he's a pretty well designed guy for introducing concepts of how to get the most out of landing successful parries, and he only has two critical attacks to look for. Both the criticals have distinct wind ups with 2 varied timings, which is kind of the core skillset they want you to build around. He even has really canned spaces that scream "please dump your spirit gauge on me." On NG+ you have to actually finish phase 2, which you can see in the clip he literally just stands still on one of his criticals being parried. Get the feeling that's there so on NG you can just land a single critical and charge up the cutscene finisher right away. He also animates well and is kinda just a cool dude. I like him.

Feel like they kinda dump him too early on most players to get any real appreciation out of. You've probably fought a single digit total of enemies at that point without being forced to engage with the parry too much, and this guy shows up and demands you learn how it works. It doesn't help that boss design kinda regresses for a few levels afterwards(and more morale becomes available to help alleviate the damage), so if you struggled against him it just stands out more. That's my guess as to why there's a conversation around him being such a big difficulty spike, while looking at him with more context reveals a reasonably designed parry lesson. They probably could've just put more of a level in front of him that asks the player to be familiar with the idea of parrying and spirit punishers, or simply moved him later and got a lot more out of him.
 
I was really curious to get a good look at this guy because he's talked about a lot, so on NG+ I sat around looking at his moveset and did a quick no hit run of him. I think he's a pretty well designed guy for introducing concepts of how to get the most out of landing successful parries, and he only has two critical attacks to look for. Both the criticals have distinct wind ups with 2 varied timings, which is kind of the core skillset they want you to build around. He even has really canned spaces that scream "please dump your spirit gauge on me." On NG+ you have to actually finish phase 2, which you can see in the clip he literally just stands still on one of his criticals being parried. Get the feeling that's there so on NG you can just land a single critical and charge up the cutscene finisher right away. He also animates well and is kinda just a cool dude. I like him.

Feel like they kinda dump him too early on most players to get any real appreciation out of. You've probably fought a single digit total of enemies at that point without being forced to engage with the parry too much, and this guy shows up and demands you learn how it works. It doesn't help that boss design kinda regresses for a few levels afterwards(and more morale becomes available to help alleviate the damage), so if you struggled against him it just stands out more. That's my guess as to why there's a conversation around him being such a big difficulty spike, while looking at him with more context reveals a reasonably designed parry lesson. They probably could've just put more of a level in front of him that asks the player to be familiar with the idea of parrying and spirit punishers, or simply moved him later and got a lot more out of him.
I think on some level, it's very hard for a lot of people to internalize the necessity of the counter system—I remember an era thread about which game mechanic was most likely to make someone drop a game, and "counter" came up a lot. Despite it being such a fun mechanic to some of us, I think it might be deeply counterintuitive on a level we don't understand for many folks

But I agree that I really like Zhang Liang. I don't know if I'll have an easier time with the next few bosses, but I really liked him, at any rate
 
Unlocked the hub world and made it to the Snake. Slowly progressing but having fun. Decided to go mostly wood with metal. I like the Shock status and use meta skills and posion to keep it on enemies.
 
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Finally beat Lu Bu with a friend. I had to farm and make a super tanky Wood/Earth build for the fight. The next two bosses are child's play compared to Lu Bu. Game is surprisingly meaty if doing all subquests, I thought I would be done by now but still have quite a way to go.

I wish they taught the embedment system better as that opens up a lot of fun and variety that Stranger's in Paradise offered. I want to make a pure magic build eventually.
 
Got my arse handed to me by first boss over and over.
I managed the first phase a few times but died quickly after.
I was playing on Series X (Gamepass) but realised I'll wait till it's on sale on PS5 and pick it up then, the Xbox controller ends up hurting my thumbs with frenetic games like this and for some reason, PS5 controller doesn't.
 
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Started this weekend continuing from my demo save, just curious if anyone got the DLC and if it's worth buying? I'm enjoying the base game, I'm guessing the DLC will be better played post-game?
 
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