Very true, turn-based is thriving right now, just not with big-budget SE games. On the higher budget side there's also Persona, SMT (okay probably not very high budget but hey), and potentially that FF9 remake/remaster coming out eventually will still be turn-based? Who knows
On what planet is Dragon’s Dogma not an RPG?
Yeah they are all considered RPGs lol. Every single one of them. And I don't mean "considered" an RPG like Horizon or the new God of War games are on sheer technicality (except maybe Nier), I mean there are all really considered RPGs....I sincerely thought all those games you listed were action games and not RPGs. Are they really?
C'mon lol, the only one I can see any ambiguity for is Nier. Everything else would pass the traditional RPG definition test pretty soundly.
Is it? I thought it was more of a monster hunter type game, but I could be wrong. I haven't played it, was just listing what I thought was the case (so absolutely call me out if I am full of it!)
I don't know about that, the argument for Souls games being RPGs or not RPGs is a very long, hard-fought battle in the internet wars. I guess yes, they are technically Action RPGs, and I can see the argument for that, but for me personally I wouldn't really put them in the RPG camp since they lean primarily toward action IMO.
To me, Nier is an Action Adventure game with some RPG elements, just like BotW or TotK.
I mean, Monster Hunter is an action RPG, but without getting into that, Dragon’s Dogma is basically a micro-scale Elder Scrolls style game with more of a combat focus.
Dragon's Dogma is an RPG with towns and NPCs and quests and all that, yeah. I do remember it used to get the Monster Hunter comparison from some western media back in the day (because Monster Hunter was "stuck" on handhelds) so maybe that's where your confusion is coming from haha.
NieR is closer to Ys than most other action RPGs.
Okay, I can concede that! It's a game I've been curious about but just haven't gotten around to playing before.
I guess there's just something about them that I wouldn't consider them to be RPGs, primarily, despite all that being true. Could be that I just have a very narrow definition of what an RPG is, and it heavily leans more toward the 'JRPG' spectrum when I say 'RPG'. To me it basically comes down to a 'I know it when I see it' kind of like OP said, and to me I would call Souls games Action-Adventure games with RPG elements.
. It's all in good fun.
Haha no worries, I am taking this all in good funOkay, I can concede that! It's a game I've been curious about but just haven't gotten around to playing before.
I guess there's just something about them that I wouldn't consider them to be RPGs, primarily, despite all that being true. Could be that I just have a very narrow definition of what an RPG is, and it heavily leans more toward the 'JRPG' spectrum when I say 'RPG'. To me it basically comes down to a 'I know it when I see it' kind of like OP said, and to me I would call Souls games Action-Adventure games with RPG elements.
Also know that I am not at all serious and I don't really care too much, I just enjoy arguing semantics about RPG genres
It's true, I know my reasoning is kind of arbitrary and I'm not even entirely sure I believe it all the time - I probably will change my mind on what is or isn't at a moments notice, lol.Haha no worries, I am taking this all in good fun
In any case, I did actually suspect that it might be exactly what you say that is causing the discrepancy, that is, your definition of RPG skews more towards the classic console definition, informed by the turn based RPGs from the SNES and PS1 eras chiefly I would say. There is nothing wrong with that, of course! But I do want to point out, under that very narrow definition, even Dungeons and Dragons/Wizardry/Ultima would not qualify as RPGs, which are, very literally, the progenitors of even JRPGs lol
You should play Dragon’s Dogma. Such an interesting game and yeah it’s 100% an action RPG.
The only thing separating it from an RPG is people who don’t want to call it one for some reason. Nintendo even has it categorized as one on the NA eShop.
I mean yes, I admitted as much!
It's not that strange, though? I listen to the Axe of the Blood God RPG podcast, for example, and they've had lengthy debates about whether the Souls games are or are not RPGs, and what is and isn't in general. Lately they've more come around to saying they are, but even just recently that was not set in stone. And I've seen similar arguments in a lot of different places before. I'm not just being arbitrary for the sake of it, even if I know that most people probably would call more things RPGs than I would.
I guess more my point was, in a lot of the areas that I frequent online, especially ones that specifically focus on RPGs, the Souls games being RPGs or not is something that has come up fairly often and isn't an unusual conversation to have, that's all.
Just to be clear: I'm not trying to say they aren't, as though I'm an authority on it or anything, I'm saying from my perspective they don't seem like RPGs. I don't necessarily think I'm right about it. And don't worry, I'm baffled too. LOL
See having played and absolutely adored both NieR games, I seriously would categorize them as action games.
This here is the way I feel. FFXVI doesn't look like Final Fantasy to me, it looks like Bayonetta or Ninja Gaiden.
Action RPGs have been around since 1984, longer than the original Final Fantasy even. You’re just being silly.
Well it wouldn't be the first time
At this point the only thing separating Zelda from an rpg is heart points rather than hit points. When you can have dozens of hearts and each is comprised of four hit points (quarters) each, the only real difference is that damage in Zelda is often taken in single and double figures rather than three or four. The enemies even have HP bars. When you’ve got a list of sidequests, optional main quests to focus on, crafting, equipment, exploration and hit points, Zelda at this point is just an rpg that’s exceptional in having spent decades carefully avoiding the discussions about the various genre labels. Like this one.
The reason for this distinction is that pretty much every Metroidvania besides Axiom Verge and Environmental Station Alpha is based on SotN (or nowadays, Hollow Knight and Ori) instead of Metroid, and SotN itself was actually inspired by A Link to the Past rather than Super Metroid. Which is why it has things like a comparatively open map, a large number of simple items that are mostly optional or block off only a few specific rooms, and a dark world. Notably, Link's Awakening is the game that established that Zelda dungeons work like a Metroid game; A Link to the Past is still full of dungeons that don't use their item at all, so it's kind of funny how they just missed each other like this. Converting Link's Awakening to a sidescroller pretty much would get you Super Metroid. But instead you have this weird situation where Metroid's signature gameplay loop that's included in every description of the genre is basically an afterthought in the vast majority of games in the genre--that is named after Metroid--because these games don't actually have any Metroid DNA, and no one really seems to notice? It's a bizarre situation.
What does this even MEAN
this is giving me a headache trying to figure this out
That's just not true. Shadow Complex? Guacamelee? Gato Roboto? The indie scene is filled with Metroidvanias that are way more on the Metroid side of the spectrum.
I love this post so much
Well Guacamelee is a straight up Super Metroid clone, colored doors and all. Its tone is nothing like SM, but it's gameplay loop is identical.
*writes all these down for adding to his eShop wishlist later*
The last two are free for PC, and I shill them (and Untitled Story which is more Vania-y) desperately and constantly. Please play these forgotten indie games. Pppleeeeaaasseeeeeeeeeeee
This is why we cannot do a checklist of features to determine if something is an rpg. The checklist can be applied to any game to determine that it is in fact an RPG.
Everything with stats is an RPG nowadays.
oh god college is an RPG??
My life is an rpg lmao
Career mode is basically dragon quest with a football
