FF16 is basically just a Naruto game in disguised.
There’s an easy litmus test: If people are upset that it doesn’t have a proper world map, it’s an RPG.
I was going to say more like Persona 5 but yupCareer mode is basically dragon quest with a football
But... Chrono Trigger???There’s an easy litmus test: If people are upset that it doesn’t have a proper world map, it’s an RPG.
I would argue that the only difference in the two genre discussions (i.e. "is X an RPG?" and "is Metroid a Metroidvania?") is that you have a strong "no" opinion in one case and not the other. Sure, Metroid-likes are not exactly the same thing as Castlevania-likes, but they're arguably close enough to warrant a single identifying genre label. Similarly, turn-based RPGs and action RPGs (let's face it, that's usually what's the debate comes down to lol) have substantial differences, but enough similarities for a broad categorization to be usefulquick edit: ill give you an example of a genre distinction that i hold that i think does have value:
a lot of people put Metroid under the "metroidvania" genre label, but i dont think it fits. metroidvanias are games that follow symphony of the nights design philosophies. other than the map layout metroid and symphony of the night are pretty radically different kinds of games. there are games that are closer to metroid than symphony of the night (touho luna night, axiom verge, shadow complex) but when i think of a metroidvania its something thats closer to SOTN (your hollow knights, your bloodstaineds, etc)
I would argue that the only difference in the two genre discussions (i.e. "is X an RPG?" and "is Metroid a Metroidvania?") is that you have a strong "no" opinion in one case and not the other. Sure, Metroid-likes are not exactly the same thing as Castlevania-likes, but they're arguably close enough to warrant a single identifying genre label. Similarly, turn-based RPGs and action RPGs (let's face it, that's usually what's the debate comes down to lol) have substantial differences, but enough similarities for a broad categorization to be useful
I think in general it's useful to have both these broad genres (RPG, Metroidvania) and more specific sub-genres (turn-based vs action, Metroid-like vs Castlevania-like). There's no need to get gatekeepy and say that only certain subgenres "count" (although to be fair that's less of a thing in the Metroidvania debate)
Nobody is upset about Chrono Trigger.But... Chrono Trigger???
Metroid 1 and 2 are now RPGsThere’s an easy litmus test: If people are upset that it doesn’t have a proper world map, it’s an RPG.
you're doing it wrongMetroid 1 and 2 are now RPGs
Yeah so based on what Dardan said, it therefore is not an RPG, because people aren't upset about itNobody is upset about Chrono Trigger.
Nobody who counts.
Have you ever sat down and read the internet? Technically Tetris is an RPGMetroid 1 and 2 are now RPGs
I have played pong, my "role" in the game is to make sure to catch the moving pixel in the screen. Pong is an RPG.Have you ever sat down and read the internet? Technically Tetris is an RPG
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Curse my lousy reading comprehension.Yeah so based on what Dardan said, it therefore is not an RPG, because people aren't upset about it![]()
I would like one major TBRPG franchise with a good budget outside of Dragon Quest, that isn't 70% social sim. But I'm not going to judge a game for not being what is was never marketed as. FF16 looks rad on its own merits. I personally don't think any of the semi-strategy-semi-action FF games we got after X-2 really nail either very well (with the exception of FF7R), so am happy they have elected to just do one thing well.
Imo, they’re all RPGs but some lean more into a the “RPG elements” than others. The newer ones in particular with their manually upgradable equipment and quest management.Speaking of this, I have always been confused about the Zelda games being RPG's, especially the old ones, because a lot of people told me it wasn't an RPG many times and I believed them, but then after hearing more youtube channels or podcast I began to see more and more people to say is an action RPG so I don't know who to believe anymore lol.
The older games (Zelda 1 and 2 and sometimes A Link To The Past) and most recent ones (BOTW and TK) are certainly in the action RPG category. The ones in between usually get put into the action adventure label. The RPG elements are so light in those middle games despite coming from the same lineage that it works well enough.Speaking of this, I have always been confused about the Zelda games being RPG's, especially the old ones, because a lot of people told me it wasn't an RPG many times and I believed them, but then after hearing more youtube channels or podcast I began to see more and more people to say is an action RPG so I don't know who to believe anymore lol.
"Is Metroid A RPG" - the greatest thread in the history of forums, locked by a moderator after 12,239 pages of heated debate,Metroid 1 and 2 are now RPGs
To me, an RPG has to have XP-based leveling at its core with associated stats that are very significant to the primary gameplay (usually combat). There's definitely room for variations in the leveling details (e.g., Chrono Cross caps boosts from "random" battles; Paper Mario doesn't directly boost damage output with levels, but allows for more HP/magic/equipment instead). I guess my definition excludes Undertale pacifist runs, though.Speaking of this, I have always been confused about the Zelda games being RPG's, especially the old ones, because a lot of people told me it wasn't an RPG many times and I believed them, but then after hearing more youtube channels or podcast I began to see more and more people to say is an action RPG so I don't know who to believe anymore lol.
Knights of the Round is RPG confirmed.To me, an RPG has to have XP-based leveling at its core with associated stats that are very significant to the primary gameplay (usually combat). There's definitely room for variations in the leveling details (e.g., Chrono Cross caps boosts from "random" battles; Paper Mario doesn't directly boost damage output with levels, but allows for more HP/magic/equipment instead). I guess my definition excludes Undertale pacifist runs, though.
It was specifically coined to refer to Castlevania games that followed the Metroid formula. It's grown to mean other games that follow the formula of Metroid or the Metroid-like Castlevania games.maybe when you come back tomorrow you can read the next couple lines of text where i explained why i think theres a meaningful distinction lol. hell, the term "metroidvania" itself was coined to talk about games that were literally part metroid and part castlevania. metroid itself obviously only fits half that formula.
Maybe it's about what seems the defining feature? I haven't played any Souls games, but based on what I've heard of it when someone mentions it I don't think "Oh, that RPG." I think "Oh, that game with unforgiving combat." Such that if I was looking for "RPGs" to play, I wouldn't find it a helpful answer, but if I was looking for "games with unforgiving combat" it would be."metroidvania" is a significantly more specific genre description than something as broad as "rpg," but i was genuinely trying to understand what value there was in not applying said broad label to a game like dark souls when it seems, to me, to unambiguously fit.
I have played pong, my "role" in the game is to make sure to catch the moving pixel in the screen. Pong is an RPG.
Can't speak for grobla123, but: Yakuza isn't really a TBRPG series since I think there's one turn-based game out of about a dozen? Octopath and Trails aren't high budget. And overhead PC party RPGs are something, but don't scratch a console JRPG itch.Do none of Yakuza, Trails, Divinity OS/Baldur's Gate 3, and Octopath not scratch that itch?
Maybe it's about what seems the defining feature? I haven't played any Souls games, but based on what I've heard of it when someone mentions it I don't think "Oh, that RPG." I think "Oh, that game with unforgiving combat." Such that if I was looking for "RPGs" to play, I wouldn't find it a helpful answer, but if I was looking for "games with unforgiving combat" it would be.
Knights of the Round is RPG confirmed.
Is there any particular reason why you couldn’t post this in the ST instead of bumping this thread againGame has been out for a a few days. I played for ten hours and read/watched a dozen reviews. I'm going to have to say "I told you so." FFXVI is not an RPG, it is a character action game.
I didn't want to stink up the ST.Is there any particular reason why you couldn’t post this in the ST instead of bumping this thread again
is there any particular reason why you feel like you need to stink up any thread about FF16? This debate over whether or not the game fits neatly into whatever subjective traits people say a role-playing game has to have is tiresome and pointless. As far as I can tell, you keep bumping this thread because you want to proclaim that you were right.I didn't want to stink up the ST.
Nofunallowed.gifis there any particular reason why you feel like you need to stink up any thread about FF16? This debate over whether or not the game fits neatly into whatever subjective traits people say a role-playing game has to have is tiresome and pointless. As far as I can tell, you keep bumping this thread because you want to proclaim that you were right.
You’ve played the game for over ten hours, right? Wouldn’t it be more interesting to talk about what you’ve experienced so far? Whether you’re enjoying the game or not? Or would you rather continue contributing to this toxic discourse about this game in particular for internet points and gratification?
I don’t understand why XVI is being questioned wrt it’s RPG bona fides. Do other action RPGs get the same discussions about whether they’re RPGs or not?