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StarTopic SHIN MEGAMI TENSEI V |ST| It's Not Persona(L), It's Demon Negotiations

Reader mode
Leo said:
Yeah, there's an npc at the end of the area that will mark remaining Mimans in your map for a fee.

When you first recruit a demon, it's automatically saved in your compendium so you can get it back anytime later if you use it on a fusion. The registered demon will have the level, stats and skills it had in the moment you recruited it, though, so you have to option to update this register later to "save" the demon as it is at that moment. Registering is free, but the higher the level of the demon when you update it, the higher it will cost if you want to summon it later. What Man God was saying is that you should generally avoid updating the demons because it will make them more expensive, which I agree. Unless in specific cases when you need to use a demon as fusion material but still want it in your party as it was, don't register any demon.

The demon negotiations aren't RNG, the right answers are always the same for each kind of demon, but there's no way to tell which is the right answer except from trial and error, so it's still luck based. Don't stress too much about this and just try to have fun, some of the dialogue are hilarious. When they start asking you for items/money, is when they're recruitable. Give them what they're asking if you have it or tell them to ask for something else if you don't. After you've given them 3-4 things, tell them they've had enough and they will usually join. Oh, another tip is that you should always kill every other demon before trying to recruit one, because if the negotiation fails, the enemy team will get a free round and they can wipe you out lol

It's a good approach to recruit every demon you see, because that will fill your compendium and, in turn, give you a wider pool of demons to fuse (by using the reverse compendium fusion option). You should unlock a miracle that will give you extra slots in your party very soon, don't worry. Also, if you have a full party and the demons have already learned all the skills they can learn when leveling up, just fuse them. Focus on getting new demons with new skills to get access to strong/useful skills asap. Demons of the same species that you find in the wild are identical, same level, same skills. Different species have different affinities and stats though, so you should consider that when fusing to make demons that are optimal for the skills you want to teach them.

You can use essences in two ways: to override your weaknesses/resistances to match the essence, or to learn the skills the essence gives you (you can't do both). So you want to use an essence when you're going to fight a boss and needs to change your weaknesses to survive the boss, or when there's an essence with a good skill that you want to teach the Nahobino (remember essences are the only way the Nahobino can learn skills, so use them!). You can also use essences on demons to teach them skills, but not to change their affinities.
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Ah, okay, thanks! Things are starting to click a bit more for me now. I'm still finding it difficult to work with the limited demon slots (even after upgrading it twice so far), though. Been not fusing demons until they learn all their skills like you said, but I'm still finding myself maxed out a lot, lol. What happens if I try to recruit a demon while my slots are full? Can I go back to one and talk to it again later when I do have room to have it join me automatically?
 
Quoted by: Leo
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Tye said:
Ah, okay, thanks! Things are starting to click a bit more for me now. I'm still finding it difficult to work with the limited demon slots (even after upgrading it twice so far), though. Been not fusing demons until they learn all their skills like you said, but I'm still finding myself maxed out a lot, lol. What happens if I try to recruit a demon while my slots are full? Can I go back to one and talk to it again later when I do have room to have it join me automatically?
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Yeah, the demon will tell you to talk to it again when you have room, so you just have to find one in another battle and talk to it again :)
 
Quoted by: Tye
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Leo said:
Yeah, the demon will tell you to talk to it again when you have room, so you just have to find one in another battle and talk to it again :)
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Oh sweet! I didn't expect that to be the case at first but then I tried to recruit a demon that was higher level than me and it wouldn't let me but it also said to come back when I'm stronger, so I did, and all I had to do was talk to it, so I was hoping that'd be the same case for this too, so good to hear that it is indeed! So I guess I may as well just do the negotiations for any new demon I come across regardless if I actually have room for them at the time or not, lol.
 
You know why I love this game? I’m 52.5 hours in game logged time - probably closer to 60 from some early lessons in save frequently even if you don’t think you need it - and I just ran into a side quest boss that out leveled me by 11 levels. Did I actually happen to have a suitable build of demons to take him on? You betcha! After juggling healers, throwing down some phys blocks, a couple Onig Criticals, and 20 minutes, I managed to pull out the W!

For those wondering, the side quest boss is Adramelech in Area 4. I’m level 60 and he is 71.

Not the first time I’ve attritioned my way through a battle, but this is the type of combat that has made this game so special for me.
 
Waluijob said:
You know why I love this game? I’m 52.5 hours in game logged time - probably closer to 60 from some early lessons in save frequently even if you don’t think you need it - and I just ran into a side quest boss that out leveled me by 11 levels. Did I actually happen to have a suitable build of demons to take him on? You betcha! After juggling healers, throwing down some phys blocks, a couple Onig Criticals, and 20 minutes, I managed to pull out the W!

For those wondering, the side quest boss is Adramelech in Area 4. I’m level 60 and he is 71.

Not the first time I’ve attritioned my way through a battle, but this is the type of combat that has made this game so special for me.
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I had a very similar experience but with a gap of about 6-8 levels, not 11. Such a good game
 
Finally beat SMT IV, it think it has been a few months I started it XD
Phew, some difficulty spikes in the end
Law ending sucked but I just couldn't go with the chaos' side plan. As much as I sympathized with some stuff, the route sounded bad. Unfortunately law wasn't good either, but I realized it too late.

I'll start SMT V eventually, I think I'm a bit prepared for the difficulty now. Curious if the alignments have similar goals in all SMT games (IV was my first)
 
undefined said:
Finally beat SMT IV, it think it has been a few months I started it XD
Phew, some difficulty spikes in the end
Law ending sucked but I just couldn't go with the chaos' side plan. As much as I sympathized with some stuff, the route sounded bad. Unfortunately law wasn't good either, but I realized it too late.

I'll start SMT V eventually, I think I'm a bit prepared for the difficulty now. Curious if the alignments have similar goals in all SMT games (IV was my first)
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The law ending does suck in 4, but I like Lucifer's Palace quite a bit, it's a cool area to end in. I need to replay 4 at some point, since Law is the only ending I've gotten
 
SammyJ9 said:
The law ending does suck in 4, but I like Lucifer's Palace quite a bit, it's a cool area to end in. I need to replay 4 at some point, since Law is the only ending I've gotten
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The route itself was interesting, it's just that
I was determined to counter the chaos' route as it was clear to me what was going to happen there, so no regrets in that front, but I didn't know what I was getting into XD so I meant about what happened, not as a negative of the game btw

Great first impressions for the series, now onto V
 
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Was very likely going to pick this up in 2022 as someone who enjoys the Persona and Pokémon series but doesn’t care for the social aspects. I know these games are tough - but I also know there’s an easy mode. Is it truly inviting to new players? Thanks!
 
zhou said:
Was very likely going to pick this up in 2022 as someone who enjoys the Persona and Pokémon series but doesn’t care for the social aspects. I know these games are tough - but I also know there’s an easy mode. Is it truly inviting to new players? Thanks!
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There's an easy mode and a safety mode, which I've read makes the game very accessible to everyone.

I recommend trying normal first though and adjusting from there. The fun is to engage with the game's systems and the difficulty is tailor made to that.
 
Leo said:
There's an easy mode and a safety mode, which I've read makes the game very accessible to everyone.

I recommend trying normal first though and adjusting from there. The fun is to engage with the game's systems and the difficulty is tailor made to that.
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Oh ok, cool. You can change the difficulty on the fly?
 
I've being playing around dificulties, and Safety mode is nice if feel underleved. You can use to farm EXP with auto-battle.

Nice to have options to make easy the Busywork.
 
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So here's my progress after playing 65 hours:
  • Level 80 already
  • I have completed Area 4 (except one absence, those who have previously played already know which one) and now I'm the following dungeon, 2nd floor
  • I have completed 85% of the demon comprendium
  • I have completed Artemis, Cleopatra and Mephisto DLCs. Fiends' DLC near completion, only final boss left
  • I have completed all sidequests except two:
    Jonsu-Ra and Shiva (I don't know yet if this one is optional or not)
As you can see, I'm trying to get everything from the game, and I still don't know which will be my final alignment.

I calculate that I still have like minimum 15 additional hours, and I'm really enjoying this game.
 
marmoka said:
So here's my progress after playing 65 hours:
  • Level 80 already
  • I have completed Area 4 (except one absence, those who have previously played already know which one) and now I'm the following dungeon, 2nd floor
  • I have completed 85% of the demon comprendium
  • I have completed Artemis, Cleopatra and Mephisto DLCs. Fiends' DLC near completion, only final boss left
  • I have completed all sidequests except two:
    Jonsu-Ra and Shiva (I don't know yet if this one is optional or not)
As you can see, I'm trying to get everything from the game, and I still don't know which will be my final alignment.

I calculate that I still have like minimum 15 additional hours, and I'm really enjoying this game.
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You and I are in similar places, except I just finished that dungeon and am slightly past there.

You’re totally leveled fine for that one abscess, I beat it in the high 70s. Here’s a solid hint: Take out the one all the way to the right first. She’s the healer and it becomes easy as soon as you do.
I did not know which alignment I would choose until the absolute last second and still had to sit there and decide.

This may be some of the best JRPG gameplay I’ve experienced. The last time I got sucked in as badly as I have with this was XB2. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been sucked into plenty of games, but to spend the full days of time on this that I have has been next level - I usually tire of a game and move on to something else before coming back at about the 30-40 hour mark.

I went and bought almost every SMT on 3DS during the Atlus sale so I can go and see the evolution and exploration over the franchise’s past. I’m not sure if I’m immediately going to hop into another SMT when I’m done, but I’m considering it. And yes, I did also pick up SMTIII: Nocture HD already.
 
Waluijob said:
You and I are in similar places, except I just finished that dungeon and am slightly past there.

You’re totally leveled fine for that one abscess, I beat it in the high 70s. Here’s a solid hint: Take out the one all the way to the right first. She’s the healer and it becomes easy as soon as you do.
I did not know which alignment I would choose until the absolute last second and still had to sit there and decide.

This may be some of the best JRPG gameplay I’ve experienced. The last time I got sucked in as badly as I have with this was XB2. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been sucked into plenty of games, but to spend the full days of time on this that I have has been next level - I usually tire of a game and move on to something else before coming back at about the 30-40 hour mark.

I went and bought almost every SMT on 3DS during the Atlus sale so I can go and see the evolution and exploration over the franchise’s past. I’m not sure if I’m immediately going to hop into another SMT when I’m done, but I’m considering it. And yes, I did also pick up SMTIII: Nocture HD already.
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I finally beated that abscess yesterday with level 82. I only used buff/debuff skills and ultrahigh almighty attacks, and the fight became a piece of cake.
I remember my first try here, they each magic attack was blocked and thus I lost turns, and their attacks with 8 turns destroyed me, along with the Pixie that healed all of them and it was like "WTF!!!". This was a huge surprise and a great abscess to include in the game, it scares you initially when you see that they are only early game demons with the highest levels and you are easily destroyed, when you only need to rethink the best strategy.

If you have not played SMT IV, try this one before the rest. It was a huge improvement to the previous games and made the series much more accessible. I would try Apocalypse next. The next one should be Nocturne, which is also pretty amazing, very enjoyable but you feel that the game is already 20 years old. Leave Strange Journey to the end, it's a very hard and frustrating game, and old school dungeon crawler.
 
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So after playing like 80 hours in Normal mode, I'm finally at the latest stage of the game, level 90 and my final alignment is Chaos.

The only optional bosses that I have to beat are
Shiva and Demi-Fiend. Shiva is very challenging, I guess I will need to grind a lot to beat him, same with the Demi-Fiend.

I have also beated
the first nahobino (Abdiel + Dazai), and I suppose the next boss will be Nuwa+Bastard.

I already have like 95% of the Demon Compendium, with only 2 special fusions left.
Baal and Beelzebub. I thought that I would be able to fuse archangel Michael after fighting him, but I can't for some reason, is this guy only exclusive for the Law ending or what?

I've met Maria in the Emporium. Being Chaos, she becomes Innana. I guess that she stays as Maria in Law, and becomes Danu in Neutral. I've been looking around all the game to meet Danu but she's nowhere, I suppose she comes out here...

Too bad that you need to complete all endings in NG+ to complete the Demon Compendium with 100%, honestly this sucks...
 
This is my first SMT game and I really enjoy many aspects of it so far. However, I'm at a point where I worry burn-out is just around the corner.
Made it back to the demon realm after the brief return trip to Tokyo and am suddenly worried I am way under-leveled. Levels aren't coming quickly at all despite some grinding.

My MC is 21 and my demons are all around 15-19. How do I get over this hump (short of turning on easy mode or purchasing the DLC)? Am I looking at a bunch of hours spend grinding? Not sure the game will keep my attention if so.
 
WellManNRD said:
This is my first SMT game and I really enjoy many aspects of it so far. However, I'm at a point where I worry burn-out is just around the corner.
Made it back to the demon realm after the brief return trip to Tokyo and am suddenly worried I am way under-leveled. Levels aren't coming quickly at all despite some grinding.

My MC is 21 and my demons are all around 15-19. How do I get over this hump (short of turning on easy mode or purchasing the DLC)? Am I looking at a bunch of hours spend grinding? Not sure the game will keep my attention if so.
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I don't think you ever need to grind in this game, at least on Normal difficulty

If your demons start leveling too slowly, fuse new ones. You're supposed to be cycling demons fairly often. Your MC level seems appropriate (maybe a bit high, even), for the beginning of the second area.
 
NabiscoFelt said:
I don't think you ever need to grind in this game, at least on Normal difficulty

If your demons start leveling too slowly, fuse new ones. You're supposed to be cycling demons fairly often. Your MC level seems appropriate (maybe a bit high, even), for the beginning of the second area.
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Huh...thanks. I was checking the recommended level for
Lahmu's first fight (Lv 23 according to a boss guide I found)
and
Loup-garou who is my upcoming boss (Lv 28)
and interpreted that as a sign I am falling behind.
 
WellManNRD said:
Huh...thanks. I was checking the recommended level for
Lahmu's first fight (Lv 23 according to a boss guide I found)
and
Loup-garou who is my upcoming boss (Lv 28)
and interpreted that as a sign I am falling behind.
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I wouldn't really take guides at face value in terms of recommended level. If you have trouble dealing with enemies/bosses, then you're underleveled. If not, then you're fine. I didn't use a guide much in my playthrough but when I did occasionally check one the recommended levels didn't really match up to my experience
 
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WellManNRD said:
This is my first SMT game and I really enjoy many aspects of it so far. However, I'm at a point where I worry burn-out is just around the corner.
Made it back to the demon realm after the brief return trip to Tokyo and am suddenly worried I am way under-leveled. Levels aren't coming quickly at all despite some grinding.

My MC is 21 and my demons are all around 15-19. How do I get over this hump (short of turning on easy mode or purchasing the DLC)? Am I looking at a bunch of hours spend grinding? Not sure the game will keep my attention if so.
Click to expand...

When your demons start to level up really slowly it's time to do another round of fusing. Your team should always be more or less on the same level as the Nahobino that way.

A good indicative it's time to fuse a demon is when it learns all its skills. Unless it's still really useful by that point, just fuse it and try to transfer the most useful skills.

Remember to check reverse fusion and reverse compendium fusion, they're by far the best methods to fuse your demons. Try to recruit every demon you can so your compendium expands and you have more options when fusing from it.

Get the miracle that allows your demons to gain experience when they're fused of you haven't yet, it will give you a good headstart.

Also, if you really like a demon but it's weak now, remember you can use elements to upgrade a demon to the next rank in the same race. That way you can transfer all the skills to a demon with similar affinities, only stronger. Element + Rank 5 Fairy demon = Rank 6 Fairy demon OR Rank 4 Fairy demon (it can rank up or down depending on the combination between the race and the type of element your using).
 
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After 90hrs I finally saw my 1st ending on Normal. I swear the game is not actually that long, I just took my sweet time doing everything. I knew I most likely would not be coming back to it, so I decided I'd see everything it has to offer in one go - every sidequest, every Miman, every boss, complete compendium pre-NG+, and so on. Is it fair to say I thoroughly enjoyed what is there but I'm still let down by what isn't? Yeah... I'll be there Day 1 for V: Apocalypse, I know that much.

Some general thoughts on the back half of the game:
  • Area 2 and 3 were a mess, visually, but Area 4 picked back up; while not as stunning as Area 1, at least I didn't have to squint when navigating the world on my poor Switch Lite screen.
  • I never needed a guide for the dungeons, nor did I need to grind bar the last optional boss (and even then, I had a big enough non-DLC Gospel/Grimoire stock to fall back on). Atlus kept it simple this time and I thank them for it.
  • I did a trainwreck (skill point-wise) hybrid build on Nahobino and the game did not punish me for it. Knowing what I know now, I recommend going full Physical mostly because the unique moves look cooler but the game could accommodate even a troll ailment build (probably), it's very forgiving.
  • Essences, Grimoires, and Sutras make bringing your favorites to the end a viable choice. I cannot overstate how useful items are in SMTV.
Early thoughts on the endings:

I'm bummed Chaos got the short end of the stick. Aogami, Amanozako, and Fionn were MC's closest companions as far as I'm concerned, so I was very "Demon Rights!" this time around. And it might not be the "Everyone becomes a Nahobino. MC lives happily ever after as demon royalty with their found family" route I wanted but I was still down for the Polytheist idea. It was different and less extremist than the usual survival-of-the-fittest Chaos bs. Now explain why the reps got the least developed "arcs" and the route gets the one ending with an explicitly sad MC. I'm fuming!

On the opposite end, Abdiel is a cool character. I may not particularly like her but she got top bill by the writing team, which helps me understand where she's coming from. It sucks for her that she's paired up with the edgelord because Atlus couldn't have Law look too sympathetic. What a mess. At least MC ends up happy?

Those endings I looked up on YouTube. The ending I actually got was True Neutral. Halfway through I decided to spoil myself on the "best ending" requirements because the story was not giving enough to hook me for another playthrough. Oh boy. Content-wise, it went against everything I personally wanted, yet I understand how it's the most successful of the lot. The Neutral rep's design and his humanity-first speeches gave me xenophobia / far-right vibes, so it's fitting you commit genocide against all demons should you side with him. This is the shit usually reserved for Law ends so, in a way, it was a refreshing take. My biggest beef with it is that the requirements don't match. You need to see how demons can be benevolent beings, that you can form bonds with one another, only to then... completely wipe them out of existence? Huh. These quests should have been used for a True Chaos ending instead imo, or rather a 4th route where you side with Khonsu Ra.

Speaking of, I bet that's the big new addition of a potential rerelease, a Khonsu/Miyazu route. It's there, it's obvious, but the base game doesn't go for it. A Shaori/Lahmu route would also be an interesting possibility, if they revamp the game enough.
 
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WellManNRD said:
Thanks for the tips!
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I generally look at it that you could stand to gain some levels if the demons you are fighting are a higher level than you, stopping you recruiting them. Or if you are gaining xp rapidly after a fight, to the point that only a few battles will see you gain a level. If your demons are falling behind, it’s time to fuse some new ones, but really you should keep an eye on your fusion options whenever you level up or recruit new ones anyway.

It’s also worth having a go at bosses and using a spyglass just to see what their weaknesses and skill list are, even if you get wiped- that way you can form a team to take them on without wasting any fusions!

I didn’t need to grind at all on normal, although I did do almost every sidequest. I just kept pushing forwards, exploring everywhere and focusing on recruitment and expanding my options for demon fusion when I needed it.
 
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So I finished the game yesterday, after 84 hours and chaos ending. It took me a long time because I tried to complete all subquests in the game, collect all Mirans, and complete de Demon Comprendium as much as I could until 96%.

I really liked the game. I loved how they created the Areas, which may not be exactly open-world as they are very linear (except Taito), but it's still amazing how they could create such huge dungeons. It may be the best SMT game ever made. It's even more accessible than SMT IV.

I currently cannot state if V is my favorite of the series, or if this is still for IV. SMT V has great music, but I think that I enjoyed the IV OST much more. About the story, I prefer IV's much more, despite of its own plotholes. Don't get me wrong, I liked V's story, but I feel like they could have developed much more of it.

However, there are some elements that I would like to mention, that somehow ruined my final game experience:

All all because of Shiva's and Demi-Fiend's fights...

We need to make it clear that these fights are just optional, but as mentioned before, I wanted to complete all the subquests before finishing the game.

Considering that both have levels 96 and 99, I always felt that my character and demons needed to have higher levels and stats. It was impossible to beat them at level 80, still impossible at level 85, same with 90,... So I started grinding and making use of Gospels and Grimoires to level up as I beated Mitamas until I reached level 96.

The point is, I couldn't beat Shiva in Normal mode, he always beated me pretty easily. So I still tried to upgrade to level 99, and more of the same.

After 5 tries I decreased the difficulty from Normal to Casual, and fine, I could damage him more, but he always killed me when I had only damaged him to the half of his health. After many tries I had to decrease the difficulty again to Safety. And yes, this difficulty mode is such joke that I gave him 10000HP damages in each attack, and he only damaged me 20HP in each of his attacks. I beated him in 2 turns only.

And more of the same with the Demi-Fiend. I had to decrease the difficulty again to Safety after so many tries.

Once these fights were finished, I went back to the Emporium to complete the game back to Normal difficulty, my only boss left was Lucifer. Well, my character and demons were so overpowered, that the fight against Lucifer became a complete joke. The final boss of the game was too easy to beat, just in 3 turns in Normal mode. This is what I mean with my ruined ending experience.

And honestly, I don't understand why did they make Shiva's and Demi-Fiend's fights so difficult, like if they were in level 150 or something like that. What's the point on doing this? What's the point of bringing these 2 ultrahard overpowered bosses? I don't get it. And I don't care if they were both supposed to be fought in NG+, no.

The Trumpeter's level is around 75 if I'm not wrong. The correct evolution would have been the Demi-Fiend being level 85. And I agree he should be a challenging boss, and I love fighting challenging bosses in SMT, but come on, this is going too far. And same with Shiva, his difficulty is not justified for me.

It would be fine for me if these bosses had this difficulty in an unlockable Ultra-Hard mode, for those that really enjoy ultra-hard bosses. Meanwhile, honestly, making average players to reduce the difficulty 2 levels below because some certain bosses extremely overpowered becomes frustrating. I don't know how many other players had to do the same as me, how many players gave up because they couldn't beat them, or which is each player's experience with them. In my case, I assume that I cheated, I know that I cheated because probably this is not the way we were supposed to play the game, but honestly, I'm proud of what I did, and now I have my character with the Demi-Fiend's essence resistances fused.

These reminds me of SMT IV's DLCs, where the difficulty was ultrahigh, even some of the bosses were impossible to beat unless you followed certain conditions that could be obtained from other DLCs.

As for SMT V's DLCs, I admit I was pretty scared to play them, and I felt happy after finding Artemis to be level 35, Cleopatra in level 60 and Mephisto in level 80. Same with the Fiends having reasonable levels. These fights were not easy, but they were not impossible either, using buff/debuff skills were enough to make these fights enjoyable and possible bosses to beat.

Another thing that I would like to complain about the DLCs is that I don't get why did they make Cleopatra and Mephisto DLCs again, just like in Apocalypse. And I also want to state that Cleopatra is such a great team member!! I love her!! She's so expressive when fighting with and against,... The artists really did a great job on her development. She's one of my favorite demons in the game!! Cleopatra is love!!

Sorry if this post is too long and too negative. I just needed to talk about my final frustration related to the ultra-hard bosses mentioned before. Overall the experience has been great, it has been one of my favorite games of the year, and I'm really happy because it's the best selling SMT game ever!! I cannot wait for SMT VI or some sequel to this game.
 
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marmoka said:
However, there are some elements that I would like to mention, that somehow ruined my final game experience:
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I tried to beat Shiva at lvl 91 on Normal and only got him down to 40% health before getting wiped out. I did not feel like grinding to 99 so I did the same as you, brought the difficulty down to Casual, got the boss over with, and proceeded with the rest of the game back on Normal, steamrolling everything in my path. I had my "I'm an untouchable god now" headcannon on after that point, so I didn't mind how easy the rest of the game was, it made sense for me. I do understand how that would ruin the experience otherwise.

My issue with the Shiva fight is that it's an ending requirement (before the alignment lock). I wouldn't have minded skipping the boss altogether to not break the game but I wasn't left with much choice there.
 
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marmoka said:
So I finished the game yesterday, after 84 hours and chaos ending. It took me a long time because I tried to complete all subquests in the game, collect all Mirans, and complete de Demon Comprendium as much as I could until 96%.

I really liked the game. I loved how they created the Areas, which may not be exactly open-world as they are very linear (except Taito), but it's still amazing how they could create such huge dungeons. It may be the best SMT game ever made. It's even more accessible than SMT IV.

I currently cannot state if V is my favorite of the series, or if this is still for IV. SMT V has great music, but I think that I enjoyed the IV OST much more. About the story, I prefer IV's much more, despite of its own plotholes. Don't get me wrong, I liked V's story, but I feel like they could have developed much more of it.

However, there are some elements that I would like to mention, that somehow ruined my final game experience:

All all because of Shiva's and Demi-Fiend's fights...

We need to make it clear that these fights are just optional, but as mentioned before, I wanted to complete all the subquests before finishing the game.

Considering that both have levels 96 and 99, I always felt that my character and demons needed to have higher levels and stats. It was impossible to beat them at level 80, still impossible at level 85, same with 90,... So I started grinding and making use of Gospels and Grimoires to level up as I beated Mitamas until I reached level 96.

The point is, I couldn't beat Shiva in Normal mode, he always beated me pretty easily. So I still tried to upgrade to level 99, and more of the same.

After 5 tries I decreased the difficulty from Normal to Casual, and fine, I could damage him more, but he always killed me when I had only damaged him to the half of his health. After many tries I had to decrease the difficulty again to Safety. And yes, this difficulty mode is such joke that I gave him 10000HP damages in each attack, and he only damaged me 20HP in each of his attacks. I beated him in 2 turns only.

And more of the same with the Demi-Fiend. I had to decrease the difficulty again to Safety after so many tries.

Once these fights were finished, I went back to the Emporium to complete the game back to Normal difficulty, my only boss left was Lucifer. Well, my character and demons were so overpowered, that the fight against Lucifer became a complete joke. The final boss of the game was too easy to beat, just in 3 turns in Normal mode. This is what I mean with my ruined ending experience.

And honestly, I don't understand why did they make Shiva's and Demi-Fiend's fights so difficult, like if they were in level 150 or something like that. What's the point on doing this? What's the point of bringing these 2 ultrahard overpowered bosses? I don't get it. And I don't care if they were both supposed to be fought in NG+, no.

The Trumpeter's level is around 75 if I'm not wrong. The correct evolution would have been the Demi-Fiend being level 85. And I agree he should be a challenging boss, and I love fighting challenging bosses in SMT, but come on, this is going too far. And same with Shiva, his difficulty is not justified for me.

It would be fine for me if these bosses had this difficulty in an unlockable Ultra-Hard mode, for those that really enjoy ultra-hard bosses. Meanwhile, honestly, making average players to reduce the difficulty 2 levels below because some certain bosses extremely overpowered becomes frustrating. I don't know how many other players had to do the same as me, how many players gave up because they couldn't beat them, or which is each player's experience with them. In my case, I assume that I cheated, I know that I cheated because probably this is not the way we were supposed to play the game, but honestly, I'm proud of what I did, and now I have my character with the Demi-Fiend's essence resistances fused.

These reminds me of SMT IV's DLCs, where the difficulty was ultrahigh, even some of the bosses were impossible to beat unless you followed certain conditions that could be obtained from other DLCs.

As for SMT V's DLCs, I admit I was pretty scared to play them, and I felt happy after finding Artemis to be level 35, Cleopatra in level 60 and Mephisto in level 80. Same with the Fiends having reasonable levels. These fights were not easy, but they were not impossible either, using buff/debuff skills were enough to make these fights enjoyable and possible bosses to beat.

Another thing that I would like to complain about the DLCs is that I don't get why did they make Cleopatra and Mephisto DLCs again, just like in Apocalypse. And I also want to state that Cleopatra is such a great team member!! I love her!! She's so expressive when fighting with and against,... The artists really did a great job on her development. She's one of my favorite demons in the game!! Cleopatra is love!!

Sorry if this post is too long and too negative. I just needed to talk about my final frustration related to the ultra-hard bosses mentioned before. Overall the experience has been great, it has been one of my favorite games of the year, and I'm really happy because it's the best selling SMT game ever!! I cannot wait for SMT VI or some sequel to this game.
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Shiva being required for the true neutral ending is weird because he's harder than any base game fight after, meaning if you killed him the plot bosses are too easy after. That said I don't get the rest of your complaints about these fights at all. Shiva, and Demi-fiend even more so, are super bosses. They're meant to be hard, them being hard is a good thing, and them being available to fight at every difficulty is also a good thing because they're fully optional and it means anyone can try and see the fight without being locked out, I mean Demi-fiend is DLC, the definition of optional. I beat Shiva at 96 on Hard difficulty and had a pretty good time with the fight, this isn't me bragging but just saying it's obviously possible. They're super difficult because ..they're meant to be super difficult superbosses? Idk
 
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I think Shiva and the "True Neutral" ending are intended to be a NG+ challenge, not necessarily something to accomplish during your first play through. They allow you to accomplish it in your first play through, but it's not exactly encouraged or possible without some serious grinding.
 
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Halfway through area 3 and I still don't understand why the story got so much hate. It's perfectly fine, non intrusive but keeps me interested enough in what's going to happen.

The only problem I have with it is it feels like you're being forced to take one side even though the game wants you to have your own opinion. It constantly asks you what's your stance, but ends up forcing your actions to be completely one sided anyway. I wish the Nahobino would thread a more neutral path during the course of the game.

But still, I'm enjoying it. And the gameplay is fantastic, obviously. I have to stop myself from play the game when my back and neck start to hurt after a whole day.
 
zhou said:
Was very likely going to pick this up in 2022 as someone who enjoys the Persona and Pokémon series but doesn’t care for the social aspects. I know these games are tough - but I also know there’s an easy mode. Is it truly inviting to new players? Thanks!
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i think its far easier than nocturne because its not random encounter. that alone helps the difficulty so much.
 
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Leo said:
Halfway through area 3 and I still don't understand why the story got so much hate. It's perfectly fine, non intrusive but keeps me interested enough in what's going to happen.

The only problem I have with it is it feels like you're being forced to take one side even though the game wants you to have your own opinion. It constantly asks you what's your stance, but ends up forcing your actions to be completely one sided anyway. I wish the Nahobino would thread a more neutral path during the course of the game.

But still, I'm enjoying it. And the gameplay is fantastic, obviously. I have to stop myself from play the game when my back and neck start to hurt after a whole day.
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yeah i think its usual hyperbole. the game is really ambitious and exclusive so it` will get a lot of haters and it succeeds in the gameplay and graphics department so story is the only thing people can dump their criticisms on.
 
Photon Rush said:
yeah i think its usual hyperbole. the game is really ambitious and exclusive so it` will get a lot of haters and it succeeds in the gameplay and graphics department so story is the only thing people can dump their criticisms on.
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I only have a Switch Lite and don't care for the other consoles as they are not portable. I've also played IV, Apocalypse (+ DeSu2 if it counts) and I'm currently at the 2nd dungeon of Strange Journey Redux; am I now qualified to think V's story and character are notably poor or do I need to meet further standards to not be dismissed as a hyperbolic hater with an agenda?

People are allowed to be critical of games without having an ulterior motive, not everything is a console war.
 
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pinkpunk said:
I only have a Switch Lite and don't care for the other consoles as they are not portable. I've also played IV, Apocalypse (+ DeSu2 if it counts) and I'm currently at the 2nd dungeon of Strange Journey Redux; am I now qualified to think V's story and character are notably poor or do I need to meet further standards to not be dismissed as a hyperbolic hater with an agenda?

People are allowed to be critical of games without having an ulterior motive, not everything is a console war.
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I'm just surprised by the reaction because I don't see how the story is any worse than the usual JRPG fare except that there is less of it (and that's something people should expect from SMT because it has a history of prioritizing gameplay).

I'm sure many people legitimately found the story underwhelming since that's subjective, by I also think there's a component of a crowd trying to find faults in the game for some reason. Same way I feel about the performance complaints. Sure there are problems and sure there are people who have legimate issues like nausea or dizziness while playing, but I think the majority of it is blown way out of proportion as there are many other games with worst performance that didn't get that reaction.
 
pinkpunk said:
I only have a Switch Lite and don't care for the other consoles as they are not portable. I've also played IV, Apocalypse (+ DeSu2 if it counts) and I'm currently at the 2nd dungeon of Strange Journey Redux; am I now qualified to think V's story and character are notably poor or do I need to meet further standards to not be dismissed as a hyperbolic hater with an agenda?

People are allowed to be critical of games without having an ulterior motive, not everything is a console war.
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of course you can. However i do not think the game is deserving some of the critique its getting. I recently played Nocturne HD in preparation of this game and storywise its about as “deep” as V is and vice versa. very barebones, little narrative, lot of room for interpretation.
 
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Got to the dungeon in area 3 and was surprised to realize I do missed the dungeons lol seeing those interiors reminded me of Nocturne and how I loved the environments.

Would be nice if the next game mixes open areas and dungeons.
 
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I beat it and loved the game.

But…

I generally think they need to lean more into developing a stronger connection between the player and other characters in the next one. Some events hit far less than they should have. They could have easily been “oh shit” moments requiring pause and reflection, but instead I kind of just shrugged and moved on.

The last quarter of the game was cool as tho. Can’t deny that at all
 
Guys I did it. I finally beat SMTV tonight. 105 switch hours....in game 85+. 8 of those hours were spent trying to beat a early boss when I should have just been grinding for an hour or so.

I loved the game. I got the neutral ending but they make it seem like it's the chaos one. Anyway, I did every side quest and can go to a previous save file and try to beat the superboss but I'm only level 85 and my party is low 80s and high 70s so I got some work to do cause I saw it's level.

I made two mistakes:

I didn't realize what those items for leveling up (myself and my party) were til the very end and I also did not do enough catching of demons. I was only able to make 3 of the special fusions demons.
 
MRC-OSF said:
Guys I did it. I finally beat SMTV tonight. 105 switch hours....in game 85+. 8 of those hours were spent trying to beat a early boss when I should have just been grinding for an hour or so.

I loved the game. I got the neutral ending but they make it seem like it's the chaos one. Anyway, I did every side quest and can go to a previous save file and try to beat the superboss but I'm only level 85 and my party is low 80s and high 70s so I got some work to do cause I saw it's level.

I made two mistakes:

I didn't realize what those items for leveling up (myself and my party) were til the very end and I also did not do enough catching of demons. I was only able to make 3 of the special fusions demons.
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I definitely wouldn't have used any Gospels until near the end had I known - I used them without thought early game. I'd have also saved a number of those XP statues as well.
 
karmitt said:
I definitely wouldn't have used any Gospels until near the end had I known - I used them without thought early game. I'd have also saved a number of those XP statues as well.
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Yea I definitely agree that should be a late in the game thing when you need to strategically level yourself and certain party members up. I will say that I was in the last open area of the game...forgive me I don't know how to use the spoiler tag so I'll be vague. The last area where you can get side quests and I was 10-14 levels under every main boss and side quest enemy. So i wished i knew abt those leveling up items then. I was getting my butt handed to me so I just ran around the outskirts grinding for hours lolol. Only when i cleared everything did I look into these items I was getting. I seriously mismanaged a chunk of hours in this game haha but I had so much fun and felt rewarded after succeeding past the frustrations.
 
MRC-OSF said:
Yea I definitely agree that should be a late in the game thing when you need to strategically level yourself and certain party members up. I will say that I was in the last open area of the game...forgive me I don't know how to use the spoiler tag so I'll be vague. The last area where you can get side quests and I was 10-14 levels under every main boss and side quest enemy. So i wished i knew abt those leveling up items then. I was getting my butt handed to me so I just ran around the outskirts grinding for hours lolol. Only when i cleared everything did I look into these items I was getting. I seriously mismanaged a chunk of hours in this game haha but I had so much fun and felt rewarded after succeeding past the frustrations.
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It's a testament to how good the gameplay is (recruitment, fusion, combat, etc) that we can still enjoy it all despite a good fuck up and forced grind :)
 
I'm probably 50% done with the last area and I've recahed that point in SMT where the the game tells you are becoming a god and you actually feel like a god, haha. It's an amazing integration between plot and gameplay. I'm unlocking those big OP endgame skills and miracles and it feels good. I also built a very OP support Arahabaki that resists/blocks every type of damage except for almighty and one element, I'm considering buffing it with grimoires and have it in my final party.

Can't wait to finally use all those gospels and grimoires I've been hoarding the whole game.
 
Got the game last month, and a friend gave me the DLCs as a gift, so I've been exploring Area 3, taking my time. This is really a game where you play at your own pace.

Been toying with demon fusion and the Compendium, and I find it funny how frequently the newly-fused demons are born already levels above my own character haha

Sometimes they get too OP also. I gathered a pretty powerful band of mofos this way, and they're one-shotting almost everything.

I wanted to get the steelbook edition, but here in Brazil they're selling for almost 200 dollars… Sellers here are completely out of their minds for Nintendo products. 😢
 
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I stalled out in the 4th area last month, but finally got around to finishing the game today. It took me 80hrs to finish.

I was really liking the game up until that 4th area where progress just stops. Then the game forces you to grind to move forward. I probably should have just broken down and bought the DLC to save time.

After grinding to get past the 4th area; so much of my end game time went into building a team that could handle Shiva and unlock that secret ending. I really wish the Grimoires worked like Rare Candy in Pokémon where you can just pop them and level up. It's just needless extra time and work to level up lower-level summons like Idun from 43 to 95 using a single Grimoire after every battle.

Once you can beat Shiva, the rest of the bosses felt like normal enemy encounters.

I will say this game is the first time I've felt justified with saving all of my limited resources. Being able to use all the saved Gospels and Grimoires during that final stretch of the game really helped.
 
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I'm so stupid I was saving gospels and grimoires the whole game because I thought you could level up past 99 like in nocturne... Turns out you can't and now I have like 20 gospels that I can't use.

I was planning to kinda brute force demi fiend, but now I'm not sure I can bet him lol i didn't build my team as carefully cause I thought I could still customize them past level 99.
 
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I've finally started SMT V this week, been playing around in area 1 so far still. I'm a bit disappointed with the technical aspects of the game, though. The pop-in can be really bad, and I've also had some rough instances in terms of framerate here and there. I know some will probably say that I'm crazy here, but I actually find something like Xenoblade 1/2 to be less bad in terms of technical execution than this. Sure, it's blurrier, but everything else is better done in my eyes, especially the draw distance.
The constant ... glimmer, I guess, in the desert parts of the area is also something I'm not a fan of.

What's also been a slight letdown is the music, at least so far (as mentioned above, area 1). SMT IV had an absolutely stellar OST from beginning to end, I found, and V up until now doesn't quite catch me the same way. I actually am starting to actively dislike the standard battle theme, which isn't a good sign at all.

To not get across as completely down on the game: I really like the voice acting, they've done a great job there. The animations, especially those of spells, are fantastic as well. Then there's obviously the inherently strong basis of any SMT game: battle system, demon collecting and fusing, interacting with demons throughout the world and quests. All of those are present here, so that's already a really good foundation. I just wish I would like the execution of other elements as much as I did with SMT IV.

Let's see if it'll grow on me, but I'm not going to lie, the thought of dropping it -- for now, at least -- has actually crossed my mind, and that isn't exactly a great sign.
 
Hi. Randomly popping up in this thread to ask something.

I've played some of SMT3 but most of my experience with the IP comes from playing Persona series. However, P5 disappointed me and made me look back on the series, which is when I realized that games I've played, P3-5, have all been... Problematic. I felt like they all tried to say more than they could, along with being straight-up offensive from time to time. P5 points out how abhorrent sexual violence is only to stuff the female lead into a suit that's uncomfortable for her and have male characters make advances on her, and, the Gay Scenes, kinda dropped my opinion about the series from the roof to the point where I don't want to come back to it.

Is there any of this in SMTV? I don't wish to cause a derail talking about this, but I don't want to pay for another game that has some crap like "gay person is coming onto a straight guy! Ewww!"
 
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