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Fun Club GameFreak is the best and most talented Nintendo developer

Kartina said:
Epd 3's breath of the wild with a 97 on metacritic
Epd tokyo's mario odyssey and 3d world + bowser fury with a 97 and 89 on metacritic
Epd 5 with animal crossing new horizons with 90 on metacritic.
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If you split EPD, you should do the same for Game Freak's subteams. The only difference is that they lack a proper name.
 
Gingerbread Man said:
If you split EPD, you should do the same for Game Freak's subteams. The only difference is that they lack a proper name.
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Isn’t the same really, Game Freak teams are more like EPD 5 having both a Splatoon and a Animal Crossing team, both are EPD 5 but they don’t share that many employees.
 
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Kartina said:
BUT if you add up all the scores of the pokemon games released by game freaks you can see the true picture:
With a full metacritic score of 562 game freaks dwarfs all other nintendo's studios output in quality, like epd 3's measly 259 metascore or epd tokyo's 186 or NLG's 223.
Even the beloved monolith soft can only hit a power level of 344 with much less successful games than game freak.
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Ehhh. I can probably find a shitty shovelware developer on eShop who reaches 1000. In a world where there are 4 Switch games at 95+, 24 at 90+, and 411 at 80+, it's those handful at the top that really stick out.
 
nah
 
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GameFreak has made some of my favorite games OF ALL TIME

And yet I'm not sure if I agree with this thread title or not.

That's just how fucking good Nintendo's studios and development partners are.
 
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Clix said:
I feel it's.... hyperbole. And the games selling so much does mean that they have this huge budget.
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Exhibit 1, a 2019 Switch Game

pokemon-sword-shield-dynamax-gameplay-trailer-007.png


Exhibit 2, a 2002 Gamecube Game

46089.jpg

17 years later on hardware at least 20x as powerful they can't produce a better looking game?
It's not hyperbole
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Exhibit 1, a 2019 Switch Game

pokemon-sword-shield-dynamax-gameplay-trailer-007.png


Exhibit 2, a 2002 Gamecube Game

46089.jpg

17 years later on hardware at least 20x as powerful they can't produce a better looking game?
It's not hyperbole
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It is. Are they up to par with EPD or Sony? No, and no one is saying otherwise. But they also have more staff and higher budgets. People throw around biggest franchise in the world, but that does not mean much because they have their allotted budgets they set themselves.

They may not WOW on a technical level, but their art direction is on point, which is what helps them. They do outsource, but overall, GF is not a large studio. Can they grow and hire more people? Sure.

I don't compare GF to other studios. That's ridiculous. I compare them to themselves. How does their new work compare to their previous entry.

But, they don't seem to want to. And people need to get over that. They seem to want to remain somewhat small.

Again, why should they feel embarrassed? They don't seem to be. Because you are? Why would YOU feel embarrassed about this? Ask yourself that first.
 
Clix said:
It is. Are they up to par with EPD or Sony? No, and no one is saying otherwise. But they also have more staff and higher budgets. People throw around biggest franchise in the world, but that does not mean much because they have their allotted budgets they set themselves.

They may not WOW on a technical level, but their art direction is on point, which is what helps them. They do outsource, but overall, GF is not a large studio. Can they grow and hire more people? Sure.

I don't compare GF to other studios. That's ridiculous. I compare them to themselves. How does their new work compare to their previous entry.

But, they don't seem to want to. And people need to get over that. They seem to want to remain somewhat small.

Again, why should they feel embarrassed? They don't seem to be. Because you are? Why would YOU feel embarrassed about this? Ask yourself that first.
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They're not even up to par with any other Nintendo studios, nor indie developers, that's why it's embarrassing. They produce games that look far, far worse than the minimum you'd expect on Switch hardware in the 2020s.

My point is that a studio cannot be considered in anyway "the best" when one aspect of their games isn't in the same league as any of their peers.
 
Clix said:
they may not WOW on a technical level, but their art direction is on point, which is what helps them. They do outsource, but overall, GF is not a large studio. Can they grow and hire more people? Sure.

I don't compare GF to other studios. That's ridiculous. I compare them to themselves. How does their new work compare to their previous entry.
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I like most pokemon/character designs but when it comes to world stuff I would argue that gf's art direction is rather shit, and if they took a more stylized approach their games would look miles better. those let's go games look great

also I think it's okay to compare games to other games

also I shouldn't be posting unironically in this thread, I am a fool
 
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Nintendo's best dev? The dev that puts out games that look 2 gens behind if we are generous?
 
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MissingNo. said:
I think canonically it is a reminder that SMG is a garbage tier Mario game.
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WHOA NOW
ducks and takes cover


tbh I still have yet to play Galaxy. Even though I own it on Wii and also have the All Star collection for Switch.
 
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Love it when people speak on others behalf on what they should be embarrassed about
 
Armoured_Bear said:
They're not even up to par with any other Nintendo studios, nor indie developers, that's why it's embarrassing. They produce games that look far, far worse than the minimum you'd expect on Switch hardware in the 2020s.

My point is that a studio cannot be considered in anyway "the best" when one aspect of their games isn't in the same league as any of their peers.
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Well your final point is subjective entirely. GF is not even in my top five studios. But it’s about the sum of its parts.

They have their strength, which is art design. And they thrive in pre set environments - while they lack in open field designs - because Let’s Go looked lovely, as did their 3DS entries. They are talented. But they have their weaknesses. Hell, outside of the Wild Area, the routes and villages in Sword and Shield looked lovely. They do best in smaller spaces.

But even then I cannot look at Arceus and say, oh that looks like shit. That’s hyperbole to me. Their are areas they need to improve, but luckily their art direction helps them.

But it’s the sum of the parts. If the sum of the parts overrides any limitations they have, sure, someone can consider them the best.

It’s like a movie. The special effects may not be the greatest, and plenty exist out there like that, but everything else rocks, one can consider them the best.

And while I like some entries more than others, personally speaking, I’ve never had anything but a good time with their games.

Saying they should be embarrassed just comes off as condescending IMO. You feel embarrassed for whatever reason.
 
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Their run from the GBA era to the end of the DS era was incredible. They'd probably be my favorite if they got to stick to lower end hardware and didn't have the change in perspective about post-game because of the way sales remain inelastic to it.
 
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bellydrum said:
Love it when people speak on others behalf on what they should be embarrassed about
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I am not trying to really speak on others behalf. It's not just Pokemon, but I hear this a bit in regards to movies and games, etc.

Personally, I find the use cringe because it comes off as, I don't know, dismissive in a mean spirited way. Embarrassing is, my pants falling off randomly in public (which has actually happened to me lol ) or if my kid ever through herself onto the floor throwing a tantrum in the middle of a market (thank god she never did that).

Devs put in a lot of work, often thankless work, and often speak passionately about something, and the whole "they should feel embarrassed" comes out. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth, as if they were a child that needs to be punished or something. Don't know. Comes off mean spirited, instead of legit criticism. Their open world designs need work to match their non open world designs, for example, is legit critiscm. I even persoanlly agree with that. It was jarring going from say, the fairy town in Sword to the Wild Area. But I also don't take it as some affront.
 
bellydrum said:
"Garbage Galaxy" doesn't mean "bait"
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I know, that's why I said that it wasn't bait at the start.
JoshuaJSlone said:
Ehhh. I can probably find a shitty shovelware developer on eShop who reaches 1000. In a world where there are 4 Switch games at 95+, 24 at 90+, and 411 at 80+, it's those handful at the top that really stick out.
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Yeah but those shitty shovelware don't sell 14 mil each
It's the combination of the 2 that makes game freak so good
 
Clix said:
It is. Are they up to par with EPD or Sony? No, and no one is saying otherwise. But they also have more staff and higher budgets. People throw around biggest franchise in the world, but that does not mean much because they have their allotted budgets they set themselves.

They may not WOW on a technical level, but their art direction is on point, which is what helps them. They do outsource, but overall, GF is not a large studio. Can they grow and hire more people? Sure.

I don't compare GF to other studios. That's ridiculous. I compare them to themselves. How does their new work compare to their previous entry.

But, they don't seem to want to. And people need to get over that. They seem to want to remain somewhat small.

Again, why should they feel embarrassed? They don't seem to be. Because you are? Why would YOU feel embarrassed about this? Ask yourself that first.
Click to expand...

but this is just a silly excuse when the games sell as many copies as they do

choosing not to have a bigger budget is a totally fair thing to criticize someone for when as the op said they've literally sold almost a hundred million copies of their games in the last 7 years
 
Pokemon is one of the biggest entertainment brands in the world and the games look like low quality indie titles
 
Clix said:
I am not trying to really speak on others behalf. It's not just Pokemon, but I hear this a bit in regards to movies and games, etc.

Personally, I find the use cringe because it comes off as, I don't know, dismissive in a mean spirited way. Embarrassing is, my pants falling off randomly in public (which has actually happened to me lol ) or if my kid ever through herself onto the floor throwing a tantrum in the middle of a market (thank god she never did that).

Devs put in a lot of work, often thankless work, and often speak passionately about something, and the whole "they should feel embarrassed" comes out. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth, as if they were a child that needs to be punished or something. Don't know. Comes off mean spirited, instead of legit criticism. Their open world designs need work to match their non open world designs, for example, is legit critiscm. I even persoanlly agree with that. It was jarring going from say, the fairy town in Sword to the Wild Area. But I also don't take it as some affront.
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I was agreeing with you, and I agree with you on all this.

Kartina said:
I know, that's why I said that it wasn't bait at the start.

Yeah but those shitty shovelware don't sell 14 mil each
It's the combination of the 2 that makes game freak so good
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It's still bait even if you put a disclaimer
 
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rickyson33 said:
choosing not to have a bigger budget is a totally fair thing to criticize someone for when as the op said they've literally sold almost a hundred million copies of their games in the last 7 years
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I think this is a fair point, and ultimately it is where complaints should be aimed at. It's not the developers' fault. The blame lies somewhere in the upper portions of the chain of command, as it's usually the case when it comes to this stuff.

It reminds me of Mario Sports fans complaining about Camelot because of lack of content. As Battle League proved, it is not a Camelot thing. It's an imposition that comes from the folks from Nintendo who are sitting at the top.
 
ILikeFeet said:
all it does is show that graphics aren't the end all be all. just having a fun and aesthetically pleasing art style does the heavy lifting
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I would agree with you for games like breath of the wild or xenoblade 3, but the problem is the art style isnt great either in this or pla. So the game just ends up looking ugly, where as zelda and xenoblade make up for things like poor texture work with a very pleasing overall aesthetic
 
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GameFreak was so triggered by dexit they straight up made a crystalline model as well for every pokemon this time around.

Yes I know it’s likely done programmatically, thanks you.
 
I have a question, if the top tier DS era games were instead released today with all their content in tact but the graphical quality is where it is now. Would the graphics be enough to change how you feel about those games?
 
EddyZacianLand said:
I have a question, if the top tier DS era games were instead released today with all their content in tact but the graphical quality is where it is now. Would the graphics be enough to change how you feel about those games?
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I mean the answer is already on the market
 
Kartina said:
I guess we'll have to wait for the black and white remake then.
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My question wasn't about remakes, but if they were just released as brand new games today, and the only thing that would change is the visuals. Would people still hold them in as high regard, if the visual issue were present.
 
Earthbounder said:
I think this is a fair point, and ultimately it is where complaints should be aimed at. It's not the developers' fault. The blame lies somewhere in the upper portions of the chain of command, as it's usually the case when it comes to this stuff.

It reminds me of Mario Sports fans complaining about Camelot because of lack of content. As Battle League proved, it is not a Camelot thing. It's an imposition that comes from the folks from Nintendo who are sitting at the top.
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Game Freak (the developer) gives himself the budget, and Pokemon games have no budget issues they have close to the biggest budgets any game made in Japan gets. Only 3D Zelda/3D Mario/GT and the most expensive Capcom/SE games compete with them budget wise

I think people tend to underrated all the resources needed to make the modern Pokémon games. Game Freak would make prettier games if they could, they already used to make them when they were able to they just now can’t
 
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EddyZacianLand said:
My question wasn't about remakes, but if they were just released as brand new games today, and the only thing that would change is the visuals. Would people still hold them in as high regard, if the visual issue were present.
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this might not be where you're going with this, but if they made ugly games that are fun I think they would be received mildly worse than pretty games that are fun
 
Raccoon said:
this might not be where you're going with this, but if they made ugly games that are fun I think they would be received mildly worse than pretty games that are fun
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What I mean is if the games had chock full of content and is as high quality as the DS era was, would the graphical issues be enough that fans wouldn't receive it as well as the DS era games.
 
EddyZacianLand said:
What I mean is if the games had chock full of content and is as high quality as the DS era was, would the graphical issues be enough that fans wouldn't receive it as well as the DS era games.
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I mean, yeah? If it's all the same quality except for bad visuals, reception would be worse. The 2D games had tremendous art
 
GF is certainly good at releasing games on time, but often at significant cost to the games' quality. It's not really something to be praised.
 
Raccoon said:
I mean, yeah? If it's all the same quality except for bad visuals, reception would be worse. The 2D games had tremendous art
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So unless GF suddenly becomes great at HD visuals, we will never see Pokemon reception like it was during the DS era, that sucks because graphics is real weak spot for them.
 
I think their issues with including basic things expected in a game like voice acting prevents them from being in serious consideration as "Best".
 
EddyZacianLand said:
So unless GF suddenly becomes great at HD visuals, we will never see Pokemon reception like it was during the DS era, that sucks because graphics is real weak spot for them.
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Honestly I don’t think so. They only struggle IMO with open landscapes. But when working with minimal structured zones, it looks nice.

And designing open world areas is not an easy task.

I just wouldn’t call the games ugly. Character designs, Pokémon designs, and the towns all look nice to me. As seen in Let’s Go and the routes and villages in Sword. Just the open world bird they are having growing pains.

I just don’t think it’s also the big deal where the entire conversation on the game just seems to go into that and into that only.
 
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