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Discussion Toki Tori 2 is a masterpiece and why you should play it

Enpsty

Enpsty

Bob-omb
Toki Tori 2 is an interesting case. It's a sequel to a GBC game and was released first in Wii U and later PC. It flopped and killed the studio that developed it (Two Tribes), but at the same time it has gained a cult status over the years. Still the game is easily misunderstood mainly because of its cute graphics.

So what is Toki Tori 2? Here is a great video from Gamer's Toolkit that explains pretty well the design philosophy.




Now let me explain how the game works.
Toki Tori 2 is often described as puzzle platformer or a metroidvania, but it's actually something different. You could called it a puzzle platformer, but there's no actual platforming.
It's not actually a metroidvania either. Yes there is an interconnected map, but there's a huge difference. In a proper metroidvania you are limited by your abilities to access certain areas. But in Toki Tori 2 you only have two abilities for the whole game. That's right you start and end the game with only two abilities: a stomp and a whistle.
You can't run, you can't jump, you can't fly or fight. You can whistle certain melodies, but they are only for rewinding or fast travel etc.

So how can a metroidvania work with only two abilities? And what stop you from access every area at any time you ask? Well, it's the understanding of how those two abilities affect the various animals that inhabit the world. There are many bugs, frogs, birds etc. that live in the world and you can manipulate them into doing certain actions by using your stomp and whistle.
Quick example: there are some frogs that can shoot bubbles that can help you float to a higher platform. But first they have to eat a bug for that. So you find a bug crawling on a wall. You stomp next to the wall to make it drop to the ground. Then you stomp the ground in front of it to make it change direction towards the frog. And after the frog eats it you go behind it and whistle to make it face you. Then you stomp the ground next to it to make it shoot the bubble.
Now keep in mind this is the easiest example. Things are getting really complex pretty soon.
There were moments where I knew where to go and thought that it's virtually impossible to access that area with only two abilities, but with careful planning I did it. This game makes you feel like a genius.

Basically the game is the anti-metroidvania. You don't get new abilities. You get insight of your existing abilities. It's a masterpiece of level design.
Now add the fact that it looks gorgeous, the ost is fantastic, it's pretty long if you wanna to 100% it (good luck with that) and the often discounts and there are no excuses...

In conclusion: Play.This.Game.
 
Wow, thanks for putting it on the radar. I'd known the name for years but had no idea it was something like this.

Apparently it's $1.99 on the US eShop right now! Auspicious!

www.nintendo.com

Toki Tori 2+: Nintendo Switch Edition for Nintendo Switch - Nintendo Official Site

Explore an enthralling forest island, learn magical songs and interact with the local wildlife to solve environmental puzzles. Toki Tori 2+’s ingenious game design requires just two moves: whistle and stomp. It's super accessible, yet it builds up to inc…
www.nintendo.com www.nintendo.com
 
Oh also humble brag, but I had the original for my gbc. That game also rocks. It's like Lemmings but you only have one Lemming and if he dies you lose. So nothing like Lemmings? Very hard to explain.
 
Yeah I heard those exact arguments a few years ago, I tried Toki Tori 3D (with gold coins I think, it was on sale) and found it pretty unremarkable. Maybe not shovelware but it didn’t feel like it would be that much better as a “metroidvania”, like fundamentally the game just didn’t feel good. Maybe I’ll give it a chance someday if I’m in the mood but its prequel didn’t convince me at all
 
Dizzle said:
Oh also humble brag, but I had the original for my gbc. That game also rocks. It's like Lemmings but you only have one Lemming and if he dies you lose. So nothing like Lemmings? Very hard to explain.
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Supporting this, don't miss the first one, even if it's a different genre 2.

And yeah, they way you have to think how to navigate Toki Tori 2 is great. Afte you learn how to use more of your 2 abilites and the return to the first levels and see the path you get the "OOOOOOOOOH so I could have done this since the beginning"
 
Dizzle said:
Well said. The closest comparison points are games like The Witness, Fez, and Baba Is You.
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I haven't played Fez, but totally agree about Witness and Baba Is You. Those games teach you mechanics in a very subtle and organic way and you really have to pay attention to the environment in order to understand their game logic.
I would also add The Return Of Obra Dinn in the same category (another absolute masterpiece).
The Talos Principle as well, even though it has more "proper" puzzles than the Witness.
 
Wow this game sounds right up my alley. Thanks for the description.
 
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Uhm, how did this game kill Two Tribes? They released a game (RIVE) a year later and they haven't closed their doors.

Anyhow I remember this game on the Wii U, it was solid and cute.
 
ProteusRidley said:
Uhm, how did this game kill Two Tribes? They released a game (RIVE) a year later and they haven't closed their doors.

Anyhow I remember this game on the Wii U, it was solid and cute.
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Afaik because of the poor sales of TT2 Two Tribes have stopped development of new games and now only exist as the publisher of their games.
 
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It‘s one of the best Wii U eShop games, and, in my opinion, a 10/10 game. A lot of reviewers, but also a significant amount of players, didn‘t like the (high) difficulty (puzzles) of the original (which was simply called Toki Tori 2, and is not available any more, I believe), though. It seems like the 2+ version tackled a lot of the complaints by adding additional QoL features etc.

ProteusRidley said:
Uhm, how did this game kill Two Tribes? They released a game (RIVE) a year later and they haven't closed their doors.

Anyhow I remember this game on the Wii U, it was solid and cute.
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Two Tribes filed for bankruptcy due to lower than expected sales of Toki Tori 2. They had to lay off most of their employees; Rive was developed after that (mainly by the two co-founders, I believe) via Two Tribes Publishing B. V.

They made at least three mistakes:
1. Counting on the Wii U being successful,
2. delaying the game to further polish it (missing Wii U’s launch window), i.e. non-ideal project management (from a player‘s perspective, this was a good decision, of course)
3. misleading art style.

Fantastic (and unique) game, though!
 
Discokuningas said:
I like the artstyle. I'm not arguing if it's the greatest thing for the sales, but for me it's part of the charm. Great game.
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I think it looks gorgeous. I get why people think that this artstyle clash with the difficulty, but when it comes to puzzle games it's common. Stephen's Saucage Roll for example.
 
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Pennington said:
I think the artstyle is such a perplexing choice.
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I agree. I don't think it's ugly but it is aesthetically similar to low effort mobile games that were popular around that time. I think with a completely different aesthetic it might have stood a better chance as it's seemingly well designed.
 
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