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Retro The Hidden Musical References in Ocarina of Time's Hyrule Field.

Mer.Saloon

Mer.Saloon

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Inside The Score – The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time Original Soundtrack – Hyrule Field Theme (Overworld Theme)
(The original article, please give it a read if you want a much more indepth and technical view on the theme than the video gives.)

This is an incredibly interesting subject I have never seen talked about at all in all my time hearing about Ocarina of Time. For all the information out there about the game, I never saw anyone talk about the music references in the Overworld theme. And after watching this video and reading the article, I gotta say I am floor having never caught some of these.

I remember at the time a lot of people giving the overworld some flack for not having the Zelda theme more prominently featured in it. But it turns out the theme encompassed almost everything Zelda at the time.
 
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This is a great find. Didn’t notice Ballad Of Wind Fish for sure, at least.
 
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I'm not surprised - while the main Zelda motif is pretty obvious, most of the rest of these are either very subtle or even kind of a reach IMO. Still, I had no idea that Kondo did that or that interview! Very interesting.
 
Stilt Village said:
I can hear Ballad of the Wind Fish if I slow it down, but the rest of those are very vaguely similar at best.
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I don't have the musical chops to say I notice either outside of the Rabbit and Death Mountain, but I recall one youtube comment mentioning how it has to do with the rhythm of the notes than the actual melody.

I defer to anyone who recognizes it and the article certainly goes into more detail over the logic.
 
That's interesting! When Ocarina of Time was new, I was disappointed that the main Zelda theme wasn't prominently featured (though I did notice its reference at the time) - I always assumed backlash to that was why Majora's Mask featured a very clear arrangement of it. The fact that the Hyrule Field theme was full of references this whole time is genuinely pretty surprising and fun!
 
I certainly remember thinking to myself "why is there no OG Zelda theme in this game?" However as a kid I distinctly remember thinking to myself that parts of Hyrule Field sound a little like something in Links Awakening, LoZ and A link to the past. I could never put my finger on it until now. This is really neat, thanks.
 
Romancedawn said:
I certainly remember thinking to myself "why is there no OG Zelda theme in this game?" However as a kid I distinctly remember thinking to myself that parts of Hyrule Field sound a little like something in Links Awakening, LoZ and A link to the past. I could never put my finger on it until now. This is really neat, thanks.
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It's a pretty ambitious theme when you think about the layers it's trying. Idk if it works for the average consumer, but it's still a good theme regardless if you get the references.
 
Ocarina of Time is the most impressive game of all time. It's incredible how well it holds up today being one of the first 3D action games in history.
 
I'm a music teacher and I am very strongly inclined to say, while the analysis about musical conventions of the franchise is mostly quite good/detailed, people have a tendency with Zelda to look at similarities in rhythmic and melodic patterns and say it must be a reference. While there often are specific references in Zelda, even well hidden ones, I don't know that I agree with like... 90% of the ones in this article. If they were saying "it's interesting that Zelda music will reuse (insert pattern they identified in multiple places)" then I would have no issue. But I think people often want to find references and callbacks and sort of imagine them where they are not.
 
Nmanic said:
I'm a music teacher and I am very strongly inclined to say, while the analysis about musical conventions of the franchise is mostly quite good/detailed, people have a tendency with Zelda to look at similarities in rhythmic and melodic patterns and say it must be a reference. While there often are specific references in Zelda, even well hidden ones, I don't know that I agree with like... 90% of the ones in this article. If they were saying "it's interesting that Zelda music will reuse (insert pattern they identified in multiple places)" then I would have no issue. But I think people often want to find references and callbacks and sort of imagine them where they are not.
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As someone who has no experience I defer.

Though the fact Kondo has never specified what his many references were in the track leaves things open for interpretation or at the least speculation. Much like timeline shenanigans.

A definitive answer would be nice, but alas.
 
Mer.Saloon said:
As someone who has no experience I defer.

Though the fact Kondo has never specified what his many references were in the track leaves things open for interpretation or at the least speculation. Much like timeline shenanigans.

A definitive answer would be nice, but alas.
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Definitely don't need to understand music theory to appreciate and analyze music stuff! But Zelda specifically, I think bc there often are so many concrete callbacks and sometimes obscure ones that are hidden, people are always looking for them and sometimes get a little carried away claiming "x is based on y". That doesn't mean the composer DEFINITELY didn't intend it, and like you said, it'd be cool to talk to Kondo himself and see what he remembers about his intentions.

In a recent Soken interview, Alex Moukala asked him about a piece in FFXVI that sounded similar to one from FFXIV. And Soken responded (I'm paraphrasing the translation I remember)

"Sometimes my pieces sound similar for an intentional reason, and sometimes they sound similar because I am Soken". 😂
 
Nmanic said:
Definitely don't need to understand music theory to appreciate and analyze music stuff! But Zelda specifically, I think bc there often are so many concrete callbacks and sometimes obscure ones that are hidden, people are always looking for them and sometimes get a little carried away claiming "x is based on y". That doesn't mean the composer DEFINITELY didn't intend it, and like you said, it'd be cool to talk to Kondo himself and see what he remembers about his intentions.

In a recent Soken interview, Alex Moukala asked him about a piece in FFXVI that sounded similar to one from FFXIV. And Soken responded (I'm paraphrasing the translation I remember)

"Sometimes my pieces sound similar for an intentional reason, and sometimes they sound similar because I am Soken". 😂
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He says he pulled from the entire Zelda series to make the overworld theme, but he's just being so coy about what made up what.

I mean, I hear the Rabbit on Death Mountain bit, albeit it's distorted but I could just be doing that. I'd believe the rabbit bit, considering Hyrule Field has this interesting history with rabbits, but whether the lore was a callback to Kondo's track or Kondo made the track because the lore is there is that vagueness of history you can't say either or on.

Do you at least have your own speculation on what you'd think make up what? Even if not definitive, an alternate take would be interesting to me.
 
Mer.Saloon said:
He says he pulled from the entire Zelda series to make the overworld theme, but he's just being so coy about what made up what.

I mean, I hear the Rabbit on Death Mountain bit, albeit it's distorted but I could just be doing that. I'd believe the rabbit bit, considering Hyrule Field has this interesting history with rabbits, but whether the lore was a callback to Kondo's track or Kondo made the track because the lore is there is that vagueness of history you can't say either or on.

Do you at least have your own speculation on what you'd think make up what? Even if not definitive, an alternate take would be interesting to me.
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I'd be curious if possibly there was a difference in wording or translation re: that interview quote. I'm pretty familiar with Zelda series music in general and I think other than the obvious callback to the main series theme in a few sections, most of the similarities between Hyrule Field in OoT and previous game tracks are more just a matter of style/composer habits. The article seems to have a solid understanding of the types of rhythmic, melodic and chord patterns that show up a lot in Zelda, and if Kondo was saying something along the lines of "I drew upon the musical conventions of every game in the series thus far to make this piece" then most of the examples in that article I'd say are good comparison points for the types of rhythmic patterns and intervals used throughout the series up through OoT. This would make a lot more sense to me than there being a bunch of little callbacks and easter eggs littered throughout that are so different in their implementation that you have to reeeeeally stretch to see a similarity. Like, there's the ballad of the windfish one. The intervals of the first three notes in Ballad are shared between the two pieces, so is it a reference? Maybe! I can't claim for sure that it isn't, but it's also not an uncommon musical idea (three ascending stepwise notes), in Zelda or otherwise.

Sorry if I've come off at all condescending, I really do think the article has a solid grasp of Zelda musical conventions, and the video does a good job of trying to showcase those examples so people can listen and hear for themselves. This (claiming x is a reference to y without solid evidence) is just a bit of a pet peeve subject for me (not at all rational). Zelda DOES have cool references throughout the series, and it's possible I'm missing some really interesting ones in Hyrule Field. I'll think on it and let you know if any ever stick out to me, but for now I'm sort of inclined to think Kondo wasn't literally referring to musical callbacks/easter eggs in the way we normally expect them, but rhythmic/melodic conventions instead. If I'm wrong, I'll be glad to change my view!
 
Nmanic said:
I'd be curious if possibly there was a difference in wording or translation re: that interview quote. I'm pretty familiar with Zelda series music in general and I think other than the obvious callback to the main series theme in a few sections, most of the similarities between Hyrule Field in OoT and previous game tracks are more just a matter of style/composer habits. The article seems to have a solid understanding of the types of rhythmic, melodic and chord patterns that show up a lot in Zelda, and if Kondo was saying something along the lines of "I drew upon the musical conventions of every game in the series thus far to make this piece" then most of the examples in that article I'd say are good comparison points for the types of rhythmic patterns and intervals used throughout the series up through OoT. This would make a lot more sense to me than there being a bunch of little callbacks and easter eggs littered throughout that are so different in their implementation that you have to reeeeeally stretch to see a similarity. Like, there's the ballad of the windfish one. The intervals of the first three notes in Ballad are shared between the two pieces, so is it a reference? Maybe! I can't claim for sure that it isn't, but it's also not an uncommon musical idea (three ascending stepwise notes), in Zelda or otherwise.

Sorry if I've come off at all condescending, I really do think the article has a solid grasp of Zelda musical conventions, and the video does a good job of trying to showcase those examples so people can listen and hear for themselves. This (claiming x is a reference to y without solid evidence) is just a bit of a pet peeve subject for me (not at all rational). Zelda DOES have cool references throughout the series, and it's possible I'm missing some really interesting ones in Hyrule Field. I'll think on it and let you know if any ever stick out to me, but for now I'm sort of inclined to think Kondo wasn't literally referring to musical callbacks/easter eggs in the way we normally expect them, but rhythmic/melodic conventions instead. If I'm wrong, I'll be glad to change my view!
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You don't come as condescending at all! I loved hearing your own input and rationale on the situation and perhaps the context of the quote.

I love that I could hear a multitude of perspectives on this matter, even if I only half understand the more technical details.
 
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