• Hey everyone, staff have documented a list of banned content and subject matter that we feel are not consistent with site values, and don't make sense to host discussion of on Famiboards. This list (and the relevant reasoning per item) is viewable here.
  • Furukawa Speaks! We discuss the announcement of the Nintendo Switch Successor and our June Direct Predictions on the new episode of the Famiboards Discussion Club! Check it out here!

Pre-Release Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door (2024) — Pre-release Discussion Thread (UPDATE: launch trailer, see threadmarks)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Reader mode
After playing Paper Mario on the N64 NSO app, TTYD quickly became one of my most anticipated 2024 releases. The sooner they get it out, the better!
 
Brofield said:
Shadowdrop during the direct, physical copies a month later?
Click to expand...
I don’t think they’d do a divided launch, it didn’t seem to help Prime much, and even then I think Prime had to do it for logistical reasons. This strikes me as a tentpoll summer game like Octopath Traveller.
 
WestEgg said:
I don’t think they’d do a divided launch, it didn’t seem to help Prime much, and even then I think Prime had to do it for logistical reasons. This strikes me as a tentpoll summer game like Octopath Traveller.
Click to expand...
True too, I guess my mind went to Gamecube re-release like they did for Metroid Prime and Pikmin. Still, if it was rated for ESRB I want to believe it might come along even as a spring release
 
0
WestEgg said:
I don’t think they’d do a divided launch, it didn’t seem to help Prime much, and even then I think Prime had to do it for logistical reasons. This strikes me as a tentpoll summer game like Octopath Traveller.
Click to expand...
It remains to be seen if 2 and 3 are getting remasters on the level of Prime 1, really.
 
Paper Mario the Thousand Year Door is looking like a major, first party release. Like Super Mario RPG, I’m not expecting a shadow drop.
 
Curious to see if any of the long backtracking segments have been altered/streamlined, that was really the only criticism I had of this back on the GC. It's a fantastic game otherwise.
 
Phoenom said:
Curious to see if any of the long backtracking segments have been altered/streamlined, that was really the only criticism I had of this back on the GC. It's a fantastic game otherwise.
Click to expand...

Throwing in the spin from the original Paper Mario would be a decent idea to mitigate the tedium of some of the worst segments.

I don't  think its inclusion would break the game as far as I can remember.
 
Didn't Metroid Prime Remaster sell fairly low compared to Dread? I hope they don't continue shadow dropping major remasters/remakes like that, because I don't think it does the game any favours.
 
BlackthornOrion said:
And are doing Another Code Recollection

You could also make an argument they did it with the two Famicom Detective Club games since buying one of the remakes discounts the other one to bring the combined cost under full price
Click to expand...

And in Europe the games are only available as a collection. Different icons but sold as a collection.
 
BlackthornOrion said:
And are doing Another Code Recollection

You could also make an argument they did it with the two Famicom Detective Club games since buying one of the remakes discounts the other one to bring the combined cost under full price
Click to expand...
Those were all remakes. TTYD is a remaster and remastering it is not an indentical effort to remastering an N64 game.
 
Hailinel said:
Under what determination? Because based on the game footage seen so far, it looks like a remaster more than a remake.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you came to the conclusion that it's a remaster? All of the character designs, assets, artstyle, music, sounds, UI, etc have been redone, especially if you look at comparisons between it and the original.
 
Cheetah6442 said:
I don't see how you came to the conclusion that it's a remaster? All of the character designs, assets, artstyle, music, sounds, UI, etc have been redone, especially if you look at comparisons between it and the original.
Click to expand...
Well, yeah. A remaster is generally redone graphics and adjusted gameplay using existing code. I don't see evidence they rebuilt the game from scratch like FDC or AW1&2.
 
Cheetah6442 said:
But it's not using the existing code tho.
Click to expand...
If they took the GameCube game and adapted and recompiled the source code to run natively on the Switch, then yes, it does. Again, I don't see evidence that they didn't do this.

They remastered Metroid Prime, Wind Waker, and Twilight Princess. You're going to need to point me to a source saying this is 100% a ground up remake.
 
There is a 3x3 matrix for remakes

Graphics categories:

1. Touched up (AI upscaled textures, widescreen, HDR, HD output, etc)

2. Low budget full graphical remake (entirely new assets and art but doesn’t look amazing because it’s not too high budget)

3. Large budget full graphical remake (entirely new assets and art and looks really good like Demon’s Souls, Dead Space, etc)

Gameplay categories:

A. Touched up (add some QOL features, fix some glitches, maybe rebalance one or two things, kind of like Metroid Prime Trilogy)

B. Remixed (same basic gameplay outline but some pretty significant changes with potentially new content, major new mechanics, like RE4R)

C. Completely changed (like FF7R)

(There’s also a story change dimension here that can be slightly less common)

TTYD looks like it’s going to be 3A with some chance of 3B.
 
Hailinel said:
If they took the GameCube game and adapted and recompiled the source code to run natively on the Switch, then yes, it does. Again, I don't see evidence that they didn't do this.

They remastered Metroid Prime, Wind Waker, and Twilight Princess. You're going to need to point me to a source saying this is 100% a ground up remake.
Click to expand...
Despite its name, Metroid Prime Remastered is more of a remake than a remaster.

The visual changes we've seen in TTYD are way too substantial to be emulation, like Galaxy from 3D All-Stars, or some kind of translation layer, like Skyward Sword HD. It can only be a remake, even if it's leveraging some code from the original in some form.
 
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
There is a 3x3 matrix for remakes

Graphics categories:

1. Touched up (AI upscaled textures, widescreen, HDR, HD output, etc)

2. Low budget full graphical remake (entirely new assets and art but doesn’t look amazing because it’s not too high budget)

3. Large budget full graphical remake (entirely new assets and art and looks really good like Demon’s Souls, Dead Space, etc)

Gameplay categories:

A. Touched up (add some QOL features, fix some glitches, maybe rebalance one or two things, kind of like Metroid Prime Trilogy)

B. Remixed (same basic gameplay outline but some pretty significant changes with potentially new content, major new mechanics, like RE4R)

C. Completely changed (like FF7R)

(There’s also a story change dimension here that can be slightly less common)

TTYD looks like it’s going to be 3A with some chance of 3B.
Click to expand...
I feel like there should be a fourth letter option for “mostly the same, but with new postgame content and maybe some rebalancing” because that doesn’t really fit into A or B. Basically what Mario RPG did, the postgame content was brief, but it was there.
 
0
Selarmor said:
Despite its name, Metroid Prime Remastered is more of a remake than a remaster.

The visual changes we've seen in TTYD are way too substantial to be emulation, like Galaxy from 3D All-Stars, or some kind of translation layer, like Skyward Sword HD. It can only be a remake, even if it's leveraging some code from the original in some form.
Click to expand...
Remasters aren't emulations.
 
Hailinel said:
Remasters aren't emulations.
Click to expand...
Mario Galaxy on 3D All-Stars is a remaster that's leveraging emulation for things like GPU calls and audio. Dropping a ROM file into a standalone emulator isn't remastering, yes, but that's not what Galaxy is.

But that was also the least important part of my response.
 
AstroOhHey said:
Didn't Metroid Prime Remaster sell fairly low compared to Dread? I hope they don't continue shadow dropping major remasters/remakes like that, because I don't think it does the game any favours.
Click to expand...
Realistically even with proper marketing I doubt Prime Remastered would have sold much more. It’s a rerelease of a game that’s been on multiple Nintendo consoles.
 
kirbyfan407 said:
I almost wish we actually had an official Video Games Dictionary managed by someone (Is the ESA busy? AIAS?) that could define these terms.
Click to expand...
A remaster is fundamentally a port. It is, by and large, the same code with the necessary changes (and potentially surrounding infrastructure, like a translation layer) to get it to run on different hardware. A remake is new code written for the different hardware. That's the difference.

In a remake there can be encapsulated pieces of game logic from the original code that can be "ported" to the remake's code base if the languages are similar enough, but that doesn't make the entire project a port, and therefore a remaster.

I think just from the trailer we've seen we can conclude this is a remake. There's entirely new lighting, graphical effects, geometry, NPCs, etc.
 
0
ziggyrivers said:
I think it’s a remake. Otherwise, Nintendo would have said so. It’s the same as Super Mario RPG: a remake without the title under it
Click to expand...
It is a remake and has been seen as such by everyone I’ve seen discuss this game. Them just calling it “Paper Mario TTYD” with nothing else tells it all
 
Another example of HD Remasters with weird situations are FFX-HD and the first Kingdom Hearts game. Square couldn’t find the source codes for those, so they had to also update some of the models and not just upscale them.

Also, mentioning SE, it’s worth to note that a remake or remaster is whatever the company calls it.
 
0
kirbyfan407 said:
I almost wish we actually had an official Video Games Dictionary managed by someone (Is the ESA busy? AIAS?) that could define these terms.
Click to expand...
Generally, I think the word "remaster" just doesn't apply well to video games, and the use of it really kind of bothers me. The definition is squishy specifically because video games have a nuanced relationship with the hardware that they run on that is just fundamentally different from how the mediums where the term originally arose operate.
 
Pokemaniac said:
Generally, I think the word "remaster" just doesn't apply well to video games, and the use of it really kind of bothers me. The definition is squishy specifically because video games have a nuanced relationship with the hardware that they run on that is just fundamentally different from how the mediums where the term originally arose operate.
Click to expand...

I'd have to agree with this. There are a lot of edge cases that muddy the waters because of that "relationship" you mention.

For example, if we took a strictly technological definition of remaster, games like Kirby's Return to Dream Land Deluxe (RtDLD) could* actually be considered a remaster, because we know that the same game engine powered the Wii original through to Kirby Star Allies. Hence, RtDLD likely started as a simple remaster (as the engine would've had Switch support through work done on Star Allies). However, the overhauled graphics and large swathes of new content and changes very much elevate the game from a simple remaster into something approaching a remake (to most of us).

*I should note all of the above is purely speculative: I've not really seen much about the internals of RtDLD to say definitevely whether it started as a port, or was actually re-written from scratch.

Perhaps a more artistic definition should be taken. At least to me, a remaster is a game which is substantially similar - but not identical - with changes made to accomodate the new system in question, while a remake re-imagines a game with consideration to whatever the new system can offer. That could be re-done graphics (as opposed to upscaled), or a new control scheme / mechanics, etc. Under this, it's pretty clear that all of RtDLD, SMRPG and TTYD are remakes. Note this definition doesn't actually consider the origin of any game code, i.e., you might re-write a game's code to remaster it.

I'm sure someone will disagree with this definition, but I think the point regardless is that you can't be too rigid with how you define it. After all, as mentioned above, Square Enix throw around both terms whenever they want!
 
Last edited:
i'll hold my judgment on the price until we see what if anything new is coming to the game alongside the new NPCs we already know about

i'll still buy it at 60 regardless with the high amount of nostalgia I personally have for it though
 
0
Hailinel said:
Under what determination? Because based on the game footage seen so far, it looks like a remaster more than a remake.
Click to expand...

It looks completely redone and different from the original. They're also heavily leaning on the paper theme like they've done with with the Paper Mario games after SPM.

It's obviously a remake.
 
Quoted by: SiG
1
Reader mode
Status
Not open for further replies.


Back
Top Bottom