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Discussion Eurogamer: What is the point of Xbox?

At this point? To control tremendously popular IP like Minecraft, Call of Duty, and Fallout, and perch themselves as an unignorable behemoth that’s permanently affixed to the industry. Like, the other day I was thinking, Microsoft could exit the console industry, causing Sony to be perceived as the winner of their console war… only for them to have to immediately acknowledge that Microsoft is now also their most important 3rd party partner that they’ll be dependent on for as long as they themselves are producing hardware.
You’re right (I think) but I don’t know if I would say Sony would need Xbox. They would only really need COD, which arguably isn’t really Xbox to begin with. Plus, let’s be honest, would any of us really be surprised if Xbox runs Call of Duty into the ground like they did with Halo?
 
Xbox was great in pushing Playstation, especially with online but overall it has been enormously damaging to the industry, they now demonstrate the worst of excess Western capitalist bullshit.
Would be happy to see them gone.
 
You’re right (I think) but I don’t know if I would say Sony would need Xbox. They would only really need COD, which arguably isn’t really Xbox to begin with. Plus, let’s be honest, would any of us really be surprised if Xbox runs Call of Duty into the ground like they did with Halo?
Activision was practically coming apart at the seams to keep Call of Duty releases annual. I could easily see that same mentality affect Microsoft.
 
Why is it "easily the best place"?
That's a big statement, I for one, think the PS5 controller is miles better and would choose it every time.
Best controller by far, best UI, backwards compatibility and cross play with PC. Plus most of the games are free thanks to Game Pass. PS5 controller is one of the worst PlayStation controllers IMHO, better only than Dualshock 3. If you just want to play games on a blue collar budget and don't care about brand prestige or whatever, Series X is the place.
 
If Xbox were to leave the console game as many, including myself, have suggested they will, what do you think the game plan becomes? Game pass is kinda a failure, I don’t think the whole monopoly thing is gonna go on anymore after they payed 77 billion over the past few years only to see they bit off WAY MORE then they could chew, and in terms of games they are kinda pitiful RN
 
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Activision was practically coming apart at the seams to keep Call of Duty releases annual. I could easily see that same mentality affect Microsoft.
True, Activision was kinda fumbling over themselves trying to keep it together, and I can’t imagine Xbox, who has been running Halo into the ground for literal years yet haven’t stopped doing the one thing everyone knows is the source of the problem, will make it better. As much as it sucks for Xbox fans, I have to admit I am kinda feeling a massive “I told you so” after predicting Xbox will implode on itself for 5 years and nobody believing me until recently
 
Best controller by far, best UI, backwards compatibility and cross play with PC. Plus most of the games are free thanks to Game Pass. PS5 controller is one of the worst PlayStation controllers IMHO, better only than Dualshock 3. If you just want to play games on a blue collar budget and don't care about brand prestige or whatever, Series X is the place.
How are ‘most of the games free’? You’re still paying for Gamepass.
 
Best controller by far, best UI, backwards compatibility and cross play with PC. Plus most of the games are free thanks to Game Pass. PS5 controller is one of the worst PlayStation controllers IMHO, better only than Dualshock 3. If you just want to play games on a blue collar budget and don't care about brand prestige or whatever, Series X is the place.
every platform has pc crossplay now, and xbox has a huge problem of constantly changing the ui, while never making it not suck ass. And you can't claim BC anymore since they totally abandoned it
 
every platform has pc crossplay now, and xbox has a huge problem of constantly changing the ui, while never making it not suck ass. And you can't claim BC anymore since they totally abandoned it
If I put in the Dark Souls disc it works. Best way to play Dark Souls on the TV.
 
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I posted this elsewhere, but the article does sum up my grievances with Xbox as a brand, a promiss and the many missed chances they had.

I´m seeing the discussion in the thread 'yeah, but it has the best controller, a good UI and there is BC!'; which is fine and all, but it is telling; to me, the number one reason to prefer a system is that it has games. If that is not one of your top three reasons for a videogame system, what's the point?

Ever since Xbox appeared on the scene, they have been handing out empty promises. With the exception of the 360 era, where they at their best. But that was what, five years in twenty plus years of Xbox in the market? Everything else was bluster, hot air, communication snafus and excuses. With the amount of money they put into the Xbox division, Microsoft absolutely underperformed in every way possible and it is laughable. What is astounding to me is that with twenty years of history behind them, they are still unable to analyze what went wrong. I mean they have so many examples, but apparantly they keep tripping over the trap they created themselves. That's the real shocker to me,
 
I´m seeing the discussion in the thread 'yeah, but it has the best controller, a good UI and there is BC!'; which is fine and all, but it is telling; to me, the number one reason to prefer a system is that it has games. If that is not one of your top three reasons for a videogame system, what's the point?
It has all the games Playstation has except for some Japanese games that are on Switch/will be on Switch 2, and Sony exclusives which aren't for me. That's a lot of games, and a lot of the new ones worth playing are on Gamepass.

And if you really want to get down to it, Playstation 5 doesn't have many exclusive games even if you like The Last of Us.
 
Xbox has always been a Halo machine for me. I don't expect future Halo games to be good given the current state of the franchise, so I'll just stick with my Series X for Halo MCC and emulation. I don't plan on buying any more of their future consoles at this point. It's a shame because I really enjoy the controller and UI.
 
I posted this elsewhere, but the article does sum up my grievances with Xbox as a brand, a promiss and the many missed chances they had.

I´m seeing the discussion in the thread 'yeah, but it has the best controller, a good UI and there is BC!'; which is fine and all, but it is telling; to me, the number one reason to prefer a system is that it has games. If that is not one of your top three reasons for a videogame system, what's the point?

I can't comprehend anyone saying Xbox has a good UI, I literally never know WTF I'm doing on it or where to find anything.

I've had all three of these major platforms since launch and I can say with reasonable confidence the best UI is Switch, of all things. Not a lot of features but at least it makes sense.
 
I can't comprehend anyone saying Xbox has a good UI, I literally never know WTF I'm doing on it or where to find anything.

I've had all three of these major platforms since launch and I can say with reasonable confidence the best UI is Switch, of all things. Not a lot of features but at least it makes sense.
Yeah, I don't own an Xbox, but as a PS5 owner, that UI is way too busy.
 
Best controller by far, best UI, backwards compatibility and cross play with PC. Plus most of the games are free thanks to Game Pass. PS5 controller is one of the worst PlayStation controllers IMHO, better only than Dualshock 3. If you just want to play games on a blue collar budget and don't care about brand prestige or whatever, Series X is the place.
Hard disagree.
The haptics and triggers (and d-pad) are years ahead, have you really tried gaming on games that make good use of them?
The Xbox UI has improved but IMO it's a busy mess.
You have to pay for Gamepass, same as PSP, it's not free unless I'm missing something, I paid for it.
I've no idea about brand prestige, what do you mean?

I can understand that you are invested in the ecosystem, like the brand etc, ever prefer/are more used to the controller but stating that objectively Series X is "easily the best" is hard to take seriously.
 
It has all the games Playstation has except for some Japanese games that are on Switch/will be on Switch 2, and Sony exclusives which aren't for me. That's a lot of games, and a lot of the new ones worth playing are on Gamepass.

And if you really want to get down to it, Playstation 5 doesn't have many exclusive games even if you like The Last of Us.
So you don't see any value in Ratchet and Clank, Spiderman, Horizon:ZD and FW, Ghost of Tsushima , Final Fantasy, Returnal, Death Stranding, Astro's Playroom, Rise of the Ronin, God of War, Sackboy etc.
Hand-wave all of them away?
What are the Xbox exclusives that you enjoy?
 
So you don't see any value in Ratchet and Clank, Spiderman, Horizon:ZD and FW, Ghost of Tsushima , Final Fantasy, Returnal, Death Stranding, Astro's Playroom, Rise of the Ronin, God of War, Sackboy etc.
Hand-wave all of them away?
What are the Xbox exclusives that you enjoy?
Of these games, the only ones that interest me at all are Death Stranding (on Pc), final fantasy (I can wait until switch 2), and astro (tech demo). I'm not a fan of the ubisoft-styled open world games or the Last of Us styled "serious" games.

As a PS5-only person from 2020 up until about 2022 I still do not own any of the games mentioned above except Ff16 and Astro. Astro's use of the dual sense is not particularly impressive and does not offset the ergonomics which are largely inferior to the Dualshock 4 imo. Whenever a game like Resident Evil 8 tried to force the trigger stuff I'd be sure to immediately turn it off. Series D-pad is much better than dualsense.

I haven't used my PS5 since Ff16 came out last year. I was using the dualsense out of convenience to play PS2 games on my PS2 using the 8bitdo adapter, but eventually I bought a DS4 instead since it is preferable.

I would say the only exclusives worth playing are Nintendo exclusives, which is why I love my Switch. For all the great 3rd party or indie games that come out I play on Xbox, usually with Gamepass. Sega in particular is incredible. A PC would also be fine but I don't like the small screen or having to use a launcher.
 
I can see the vision of what Phil Spencer wanted Xbox to be. Look at how Nintendo essentially has a game every month, peppered in with classic games being made available and 3rd party offerings. If Microsoft had managed all it's teams and acquisitions well, you could in theory see a new MS 1st party exclusive every month, mixed in with adding classic games and licensing 3rd party titles for gamepass. You add in a mobile store component and have gamepass be like Netflix for games, one subscription across any device to play games.

The problem is Microsoft has had horrible project management across the board and seemingly can't get anything released timely and/or in an acceptable state. All their big ips either are at their lowest point (Halo, Gears), far off from getting new titles (Fallout, Elder Scrolls), or are too big and must be multiplatform adding no value to the Xbox brand (Minecraft, CoD). Beyond that you have/had smaller studios like Tango, Double Fine, and Ninja Theory who's games never lit up sales charts but were critical darlings and greatly appreciated by your audience. That was fine when there was a belief that gamepass/streaming was the infinite money valve and the big games would subsidize the smaller ones. Tragically the big games are nowhere to be found or are under performing expectations, leading to the current disaster.
 
Very length article, but some key points below. Honestly, I've been asking myself the same thing, even before the shift in strategy by bringing games to other platforms.
the impression i get for the 20 years of Xbox, is that the lack a clearly business vision/model, you look at Sony/Nintendo with very clear visions, but looking at Microsoft, they seens like, let shoot at everything and hope this suceed, they are too reactiorary,
 
Now Phil and his team find themselves at the far end of a Bond villain's big table, with the head honchos stroking white cats and spouting lines like 'remember, this organisation does not tolerate failure.' So they're now stuck in a rock and a hard place. They need to prove that Xbox has not only value, but can generate significant profit. Hence this drastic realignment. And if they fail, then people more powerful than them will make this realignment even more drastic.
“So Phil, how are you and the rest of the team going to do to pay back the $70bn loan we gave you to go buy ABK?”

overall it has been enormously damaging to the industry
People really need to watch MS’s GDC keynote from 2005. From what I remember that was ground zero for things like horse armor, pay to win, achievement chasing for gamerscore, etc.

I can see the vision of what Phil Spencer wanted Xbox to be. Look at how Nintendo essentially has a game every month, peppered in with classic games being made available and 3rd party offerings. If Microsoft had managed all it's teams and acquisitions well, you could in theory see a new MS 1st party exclusive every month, mixed in with adding classic games and licensing 3rd party titles for gamepass. You add in a mobile store component and have gamepass be like Netflix for games, one subscription across any device to play games.

The problem is Microsoft has had horrible project management across the board and seemingly can't get anything released timely and/or in an acceptable state. All their big ips either are at their lowest point (Halo, Gears), far off from getting new titles (Fallout, Elder Scrolls), or are too big and must be multiplatform adding no value to the Xbox brand (Minecraft, CoD). Beyond that you have/had smaller studios like Tango, Double Fine, and Ninja Theory who's games never lit up sales charts but were critical darlings and greatly appreciated by your audience. That was fine when there was a belief that gamepass/streaming was the infinite money valve and the big games would subsidize the smaller ones. Tragically the big games are nowhere to be found or are under performing expectations, leading to the current disaster.
Yea, I thought MS’s general strategy for the last 5 years or so was that they were trying to kickstart their own back catalog and first party development program, plus diversifying away from shooters, by doing the usual MS thing of throwing gobs of money around to buy their way in.

I guess that really didn’t work out that well and now we get to watch the ugly hangover
 
I blame Phil Spencer for the troubles at Xbox. He's been in charge there for what, 10 years now? It's time for a reshuffle and move him to a different role within Microsoft or they get him to "retire" from the company. They've bungled so many acquisitions it seems like they're burning Microsoft's money on purpose. The mess they're in now proves governments were correct when they tried to stop the Activision-Blizzard acquisition, as it's resulted in thousands of jobs lost and many studios closed. The government not stepping in to prevent these sacrificial mergers is having a tremendous negative impact for jobs and studios around the world, as well as the gaming industry writ large.
 
Xbox was great in pushing Playstation, especially with online but overall it has been enormously damaging to the industry, they now demonstrate the worst of excess Western capitalist bullshit.
Would be happy to see them gone.
In a way yea, but If Sony was the only actor in the high performance home console space, who knows what they might pull.
 
As an owner of both the xbox series x and xbox series s. Seeing Microsoft shut down talented studios when xbox needs more great games, I'm also asking myself.

What is the point of xbox?
 
You’re right (I think) but I don’t know if I would say Sony would need Xbox. They would only really need COD, which arguably isn’t really Xbox to begin with. Plus, let’s be honest, would any of us really be surprised if Xbox runs Call of Duty into the ground like they did with Halo?
COD was/is already being run into the ground. If anything the MS takeover gives us a chance of that not happening in the future. However, I expect them to maintain yearly releases for the foreseeable future.
 
In a way yea, but If Sony was the only actor in the high performance home console space, who knows what they might pull.
True, that's why we need the return of the King.
iu
 
Of these games, the only ones that interest me at all are Death Stranding (on Pc), final fantasy (I can wait until switch 2), and astro (tech demo). I'm not a fan of the ubisoft-styled open world games or the Last of Us styled "serious" games.

As a PS5-only person from 2020 up until about 2022 I still do not own any of the games mentioned above except Ff16 and Astro. Astro's use of the dual sense is not particularly impressive and does not offset the ergonomics which are largely inferior to the Dualshock 4 imo. Whenever a game like Resident Evil 8 tried to force the trigger stuff I'd be sure to immediately turn it off. Series D-pad is much better than dualsense.

I haven't used my PS5 since Ff16 came out last year. I was using the dualsense out of convenience to play PS2 games on my PS2 using the 8bitdo adapter, but eventually I bought a DS4 instead since it is preferable.

I would say the only exclusives worth playing are Nintendo exclusives, which is why I love my Switch. For all the great 3rd party or indie games that come out I play on Xbox, usually with Gamepass. Sega in particular is incredible. A PC would also be fine but I don't like the small screen or having to use a launcher.
Each to their own I suppose, I love the "trigger stuff", think it's been one of the few genuine technical advancements this gen.
Even with how poor the Xbox has been, to state that none of their exclusives and none of Sony's are worth playing, is quite the take.
 
Xbox just has no brand anymore. In the 360 era it was the edgelord shooter/online machine and while that was a limiting identity, it was at least an identity. Following that they just kinda jumped ship from that into... well whatever the Kinect era was, then followed by the Xbox One stuff. Microsoft just didn't cultivate anything they had from the 360 era due to their whole TV spiel. Never felt like they came back to that in any meaningful way aside from mass aquisitions.
 
the impression i get for the 20 years of Xbox, is that the lack a clearly business vision/model, you look at Sony/Nintendo with very clear visions, but looking at Microsoft, they seens like, let shoot at everything and hope this suceed, they are too reactiorary,
It’s that and the fact that Microsoft doesn’t have a culture for making content. Microsoft’s bread and butter is enterprise software.

Nintendo used to be a toy company and Sony has always been an entertainment company. So, both of them understand gaming in ways Microsoft doesn’t. You’d think though after 20+ years Microsoft would have an idea, but they seemingly don’t.
 
It’s that and the fact that Microsoft doesn’t have a culture for making content. Microsoft’s bread and butter is enterprise software.

Nintendo used to be a toy company and Sony has always been an entertainment company. So, both of them understand gaming in ways Microsoft doesn’t. You’d think though after 20+ years Microsoft would have an idea, but they seemingly don’t.
Coincidentally this is also why I never believe Apple each year they do the whole “we’re serious about games this time” presentation
 
Coincidentally this is also why I never believe Apple each year they do the whole “we’re serious about games this time” presentation
And even Apple has been in a rut and haven't succeeded at much new beyond annual iPhone updates. Steve Jobs was an absolute prick on a galactic scale, but he did manage to push innovation that Apple just doesn't anymore.
 
Each to their own I suppose, I love the "trigger stuff", think it's been one of the few genuine technical advancements this gen.
Even with how poor the Xbox has been, to state that none of their exclusives and none of Sony's are worth playing, is quite the take.
Glad you can enjoy it. I'm sure there are people who love Starfield too, yeah. Not for me.
 
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Ever since Xbox appeared on the scene, they have been handing out empty promises. With the exception of the 360 era, where they at their best. But that was what, five years in twenty plus years of Xbox in the market? Everything else was bluster, hot air, communication snafus and excuses. With the amount of money they put into the Xbox division, Microsoft absolutely underperformed in every way possible and it is laughable. What is astounding to me is that with twenty years of history behind them, they are still unable to analyze what went wrong. I mean they have so many examples, but apparantly they keep tripping over the trap they created themselves. That's the real shocker to me,

I'd push back on this a little bit. While the OG Xbox wasn't a sales juggernaut like the PS2, it absolutely earned Microsoft their place at the console table. Like I said in the OG Xbox thread, even if you look past Halo, Microsoft were able to secure a smorgasbord of top tier games and exclusives for the system, many that are just as good as any game on the PS2. The Xbox itself pretty much set the template for console design and features for subsequent generations.

It's from the Xbox One onwards that things started heading south in a bad way
 
I think it's missing the point that "growth, growth and growth" is also everyone else's mission, it just so happens that Sony and Nintendo nailed it and Microsoft failed miserably.
Nintendo isn't growth-oriented in the way that the current Western economy is designed around. Nintendo is profit-oriented, which is a very different thing.
 
I'd push back on this a little bit. While the OG Xbox wasn't a sales juggernaut like the PS2, it absolutely earned Microsoft their place at the console table. Like I said in the OG Xbox thread, even if you look past Halo, Microsoft were able to secure a smorgasbord of top tier games and exclusives for the system, many that are just as good as any game on the PS2. The Xbox itself pretty much set the template for console design and features for subsequent generations.

It's from the Xbox One onwards that things started heading south in a bad way
Fair enough.

I can understand from that viewpoint why OG Xbox was important for future hardware to come. I think I just did not gel with the identity it had back in the day.
 
Coincidentally this is also why I never believe Apple each year they do the whole “we’re serious about games this time” presentation
I actually think Apple should probably do more, especially with AppleTV boxes being able to connect a DualSense or Xbox controller. But I don’t think they’d do well managing any studios.
 
The only problem with xbox is that they are really unsure on what to do and listen too much on the audience, if they had a 5 year plan relying on timed exclusives and first party games there wouldnt be much to talk about, i bought a series S as a complement for my switch and im having a blast with only gamepass and sub 20 dollar games on it, i dont need more aside from the japanese games that dont come out on it, but thats what switch is for.
 
The only problem with xbox is that they are really unsure on what to do and listen too much on the audience, if they had a 5 year plan relying on timed exclusives and first party games there wouldnt be much to talk about, i bought a series S as a complement for my switch and im having a blast with only gamepass and sub 20 dollar games on it, i dont need more aside from the japanese games that dont come out on it, but thats what switch is for.
I don't know the Xbox ecosystem well enough to comment on listening to fans part but for better or worse Nintendo and Sony do their thing and drag their fans with them. I never got a sense Xbox had that roadmap, except perhaps briefly during 360 when they had a clear vision for online subscription services being their core pillar
 


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