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Discussion the next zelda should make seafaring and underwater exploration its main focus

Tall Valley Nerd

Tall Valley Nerd

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recently i was playing the latest region added to genshin impact and having a blast the region to the ones who do not know completely focus on underwater exploration and oh my god this the best underwater exploration i have seen in any non survival open world game no open world game came even close to match it the seas are vast and not just a view you will dive in it and explore ruins filled with secrets while solving puzzles taking on challenges and fighting mini bosses and there is really some very clever part like once i was on a huge island and saw a small but deep lake that you can swim through it and you can reach the other side of the island.
and that made me realize how much potential underwater exploration offer with its inherent vertical nature and depth over ground and even sky islands exploration
and i think its the perfect approach that the next zelda could take it
but what you think
 
Tall Valley Nerd said:
recently i was playing the latest region added to genshin impact and having a blast the region to the ones who do not know completely focus on underwater exploration and oh my god this the best underwater exploration i have seen in any non survival open world game no open world game came even close to match it the seas are vast and not just a view you will dive in it and explore ruins filled with secrets while solving puzzles taking on challenges and fighting mini bosses and there is really some very clever part like once i was on a huge island and saw a small but deep lake that you can swim through it and you can reach the other side of the island.
and that made me realize how much potential underwater exploration offer with its inherent vertical nature and depth over ground and even sky islands exploration
and i think its the perfect approach that the next zelda could take it
but what you think
Click to expand...
They should have Link and Ys’s Adol team up to see who can wreck the most ships over the course of a game, every dungeon starting with them washing up on a convenient beach somewhere.
 
I don't know about focus, but definitely play a bigger part in gameplay for sure.
 
I think managing oxygen would be a super interesting wrinkle to the whole "go anywhere, do anything" ethos.

As in, you could still do it, but you'd have to think about it. You'd have to be careful. Like climbing without upgrading your stamina in Breath of the Wild.


The other interesting aspect would be water-manipulation powers, but I doubt the Switch 2 could handle it
 
I'd agree with this.

Imagine the how great water could be if it becomes a focus with how amazing the physics of BotW & TotK are.

"The Legend of Zelda : Wave Race 3"
 
Maybe I need to finally play Genshin then wow

Forbidden West has some cool underwater exploration, though many areas can be pretty repetitive. Would have liked to see some underwater areas in TOTK but cant really complain
 
Given how both recent 3D games had very little interaction with water other than as a surface you land on, I could see water being both a core mechanic and a core theme in the next title. Imagine being able to control and manipulate water in a lot of interesting ways.
 
I feel like people complained so much about the swimming controls in skyward sword and the tadtone quest, and the message was sent that people don't like underwater gameplay. I have a lot of issues with skyward, but the underwater gameplay isn't one of them.

Underwater is pretty integral to Zelda gameplay to me. Oot, MM, TP, SS, all have a progression of unlocking the ability to freely swim, and or walk under the water. WW being the odd one out was always so strange to me seeing as the setting is a vast ocean.

With Botw's heavy focus on nature, there was a big missed opportunity to incorporate aquatic environments. And totk's cave systems and focus on building machines, underwater would have been an incredible addition.
 
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I generally don’t enjoy swimming in games, particularly of the underwater variety, so underwater exploration isn’t something I especially want or need. Every time it shows up in Zelda games, I slog through it.

Controlling water, though? I could see that being fun.
 
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Swimming in Horizon FW is pretty sweet, so I could definitely see it working well in Zelda.

I could absolutely get behind a flooded BOTW/TOTK world, but sounds like the dev team perhaps want to build a new world.
 
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TheCongressman said:
I feel like people complained so much about the swimming controls in skyward sword and the tadtone quest, and the message was sent that people don't like underwater gameplay. I have a lot of issues with skyward, but the underwater gameplay isn't one of them.

Underwater is pretty integral to Zelda gameplay to me. Oot, MM, TP, SS, all have a progression of unlocking the ability to freely swim, and or walk under the water. WW being the odd one out was always so strange to me seeing as the setting is a vast ocean.

With Botw's heavy focus on nature, there was a big missed opportunity to incorporate aquatic environments. And totk's cave systems and focus on building machines, underwater would have been an incredible addition.
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The ocean being vast in WW is probably the reason it didn't let you explore underwater. It would basically double the size of the map
 
Tall Valley Nerd said:
recently i was playing the latest region added to genshin impact and having a blast the region to the ones who do not know completely focus on underwater exploration and oh my god this the best underwater exploration i have seen in any non survival open world game no open world game came even close to match it the seas are vast and not just a view you will dive in it and explore ruins filled with secrets while solving puzzles taking on challenges and fighting mini bosses and there is really some very clever part like once i was on a huge island and saw a small but deep lake that you can swim through it and you can reach the other side of the island.
and that made me realize how much potential underwater exploration offer with its inherent vertical nature and depth over ground and even sky islands exploration
and i think its the perfect approach that the next zelda could take it
but what you think
Click to expand...
i knew before even opening this thread that it was genshin impact inspired.

but yeah, zelda can really learn from genshin impact, it took the skeleton of open world botw provided and made it much, much better.
 
catonkatonk said:
I think managing oxygen would be a super interesting wrinkle to the whole "go anywhere, do anything" ethos.

As in, you could still do it, but you'd have to think about it. You'd have to be careful. Like climbing without upgrading your stamina in Breath of the Wild.


The other interesting aspect would be water-manipulation powers, but I doubt the Switch 2 could handle it
Click to expand...
one of the reasons genshin impacts underwater is so good is no oxygen, they didn't want to limit the exploration and level design that could be done by abandoning a closer adherence to reality and common underwater tropes.

a reason why underwater genshin impact exploration good is because they dont treat it like underwater exploration

its just more exploration that happens to be underwater.

i think that putting a limit on underwater exploration only negates it,as after playing genshin you can really tell how much of a difference it makes.
 
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Djehuty said:
i knew before even opening this thread that it was genshin impact inspired.

but yeah, zelda can really learn from genshin impact, it took the skeleton of open world botw provided and made it much, much better.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, I just have to say, how do you think it made it so much better? I tried playing it, but I could not get into it. While the world is pretty, the gameplay lacks everything that makes Botw appealing. You can climb and glide sure, but you can't interact with the environment beyond that.
 
It would be the first Zelda game I skip I think. I have loads of problems with boat traversal in every game I've played with it, including Windwaker, and underwater exploration and combat often just boils down to slower and clunkier than on land. I really do not want to boat around with practically 0 input like Windwaker and then have to put and take off iron boots to explore the game.
 
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I would like to see some form of underwater exploration, but unsure if I want that (or seafaring) to be the next game's main focus. I do like Wind Waker a lot, for whatever that's worth.
 
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Yes the thing people hate the most about most nintendo games and even other franchises (Monster Hunter for example) lol
 
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TheCongressman said:
I'm sorry, I just have to say, how do you think it made it so much better? I tried playing it, but I could not get into it. While the world is pretty, the gameplay lacks everything that makes Botw appealing. You can climb and glide sure, but you can't interact with the environment beyond that.
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its what comes after the first area, aadn the second really.

as genshin is a lvie serivdce game each .0 update can ganerlally be reagarded like a new game wihtin an overarching story.
a lot of levle desing changes occur and some things are added and removed for example four leaf clovers you used to get around in sumeure are gone because sumeure had cliffs that were impossible to climb due ot thier curveture, the genral artsyle of fontaine uses mountins that exclsuive go up with no rocky surfaces that may overhang anywhere

each region kinda has a different design ethos, fontaine refers back to the large and empty feeling of mondstadt but actually puts content in it, the designing of the buildings and area around them are a lot more detailed, whit a lot of them serving towards a game play function, (like the water portals, airship things and so on as well as a ralther city. as well as having a more coherent world. all the ports, the prsiosn, the city, the way all that is layed out makes sense within the world, meanhwile mondstatd is a town, i nthe wildenerrs, and theres also naohter town.

as it is a live service game, you only experienced a tiny part of the world to its current standards, which are a lot higher and is basically unrivalled in the current landscape, nor will a full price game ever be able to rival its scale and purposefulness put together, its sjut an impossible task, its 1 mile wide and 10 miles deeper, at least with the current areas, the older oens are very, boring.

unfortunately to experience this yoou kinda need to slog through the first 12 hours and then walk towards the other end of the continent first.

this is an old vid but it should help get my point across
 
After exploring the surface, sky and underground of Hyrule, I think it's time we got an open ocean map. In terms of swimming and underwater segments, I think those could be reserved for specific instances, like some islands or shrines. Maybe even dungeons
 
Djehuty said:
its what comes after the first area, aadn the second really.

as genshin is a lvie serivdce game each .0 update can ganerlally be reagarded like a new game wihtin an overarching story.
a lot of levle desing changes occur and some things are added and removed for example four leaf clovers you used to get around in sumeure are gone because sumeure had cliffs that were impossible to climb due ot thier curveture, the genral artsyle of fontaine uses mountins that exclsuive go up with no rocky surfaces that may overhang anywhere

each region kinda has a different design ethos, fontaine refers back to the large and empty feeling of mondstadt but actually puts content in it, the designing of the buildings and area around them are a lot more detailed, whit a lot of them serving towards a game play function, (like the water portals, airship things and so on as well as a ralther city. as well as having a more coherent world. all the ports, the prsiosn, the city, the way all that is layed out makes sense within the world, meanhwile mondstatd is a town, i nthe wildenerrs, and theres also naohter town.

as it is a live service game, you only experienced a tiny part of the world to its current standards, which are a lot higher and is basically unrivalled in the current landscape, nor will a full price game ever be able to rival its scale and purposefulness put together, its sjut an impossible task, its 1 mile wide and 10 miles deeper, at least with the current areas, the older oens are very, boring.

unfortunately to experience this yoou kinda need to slog through the first 12 hours and then walk towards the other end of the continent first.

this is an old vid but it should help get my point across
Click to expand...


Oh ok, so you're just saying visually the environments are an improvement. Yeah the environments are gorgeous and way more varied, I would love to put those maps into Botw.
 
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Couldn't agree more.

The possibilities are mouth-watering to me. I imagine Hyrule this time to be a continent - not a huge sea like Wind Waker, but landmasses separated by large lakes. Traversal over the water would be Wind Waker-like, but take shorter time, because the lakes are not as big.

Then, anywhere, at any time, you can go underwater. It's a method of exploration that has so, so much possibilities. Not only could Nintendo potentially make an underwater world that is drop-dead gorgeous, it's also a setting ripe for constructing a world that is mysterious, alluring and rich with secrets. There can be huge dungeon-like caves, or bottomless chasms, or an underwater civilization populated by a brand new race. And much, much more.

Not to mention the methods of traversal as well - later Zeldas has placed a huge emphasis on traversal, and you could traverse underwater environments in so many ways. Not by slow, dull swimming, but by speeding around like a dolphin, jump around in a sort of low-gravity mode, or just simply walk on the bottom of the ocean, all with special items or spells.

I'd say, bring it.
 
I’ve thought about the same thing before and it would be awesome. Anything that takes place underwater or on the ocean floor is automatically thrilling to me.

The moment where you come across Ganon’s petrified body from the end of WW and pull the Master Sword out of his forehead, freeing him from his prison of stone would be an all timer.
 
If anything, an underwater Hyrule would get rid of one of BotW’s biggest frustrations. (Accidentally drop a gemstone in the water and watch it sink)
 
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I’m not sure I want it to be the focus but it’d be a very natural addition to the BotW template. After I finished TotK I started dreaming about a third game that takes Link and Zelda to Holodrum and Labrynna with Subrosia and the Zora Seas, combining everything from the Fujibayashi-directed titles in one game.
 
Irene said:
Couldn't agree more.

The possibilities are mouth-watering to me. I imagine Hyrule this time to be a continent - not a huge sea like Wind Waker, but landmasses separated by large lakes. Traversal over the water would be Wind Waker-like, but take shorter time, because the lakes are not as big.

Then, anywhere, at any time, you can go underwater. It's a method of exploration that has so, so much possibilities. Not only could Nintendo potentially make an underwater world that is drop-dead gorgeous, it's also a setting ripe for constructing a world that is mysterious, alluring and rich with secrets. There can be huge dungeon-like caves, or bottomless chasms, or an underwater civilization populated by a brand new race. And much, much more.

Not to mention the methods of traversal as well - later Zeldas has placed a huge emphasis on traversal, and you could traverse underwater environments in so many ways. Not by slow, dull swimming, but by speeding around like a dolphin, jump around in a sort of low-gravity mode, or just simply walk on the bottom of the ocean, all with special items or spells.

I'd say, bring it.
Click to expand...
I think an archipelago of big islands will be better
 
Djehuty said:
its what comes after the first area, aadn the second really.

as genshin is a lvie serivdce game each .0 update can ganerlally be reagarded like a new game wihtin an overarching story.
a lot of levle desing changes occur and some things are added and removed for example four leaf clovers you used to get around in sumeure are gone because sumeure had cliffs that were impossible to climb due ot thier curveture, the genral artsyle of fontaine uses mountins that exclsuive go up with no rocky surfaces that may overhang anywhere

each region kinda has a different design ethos, fontaine refers back to the large and empty feeling of mondstadt but actually puts content in it, the designing of the buildings and area around them are a lot more detailed, whit a lot of them serving towards a game play function, (like the water portals, airship things and so on as well as a ralther city. as well as having a more coherent world. all the ports, the prsiosn, the city, the way all that is layed out makes sense within the world, meanhwile mondstatd is a town, i nthe wildenerrs, and theres also naohter town.

as it is a live service game, you only experienced a tiny part of the world to its current standards, which are a lot higher and is basically unrivalled in the current landscape, nor will a full price game ever be able to rival its scale and purposefulness put together, its sjut an impossible task, its 1 mile wide and 10 miles deeper, at least with the current areas, the older oens are very, boring.

unfortunately to experience this yoou kinda need to slog through the first 12 hours and then walk towards the other end of the continent first.

this is an old vid but it should help get my point across
Click to expand...

Ive started the game and think the same yeah. Though the 1st region so far is alright. I saw you have to go through the fairly long tutorial to get to Fontaine though lol, and other regions. Im trying to go fast but still enjoying the opening hours quite a bit.
 
Legend of Zelda: The Way of Water

avatar-avatar2.gif
 
Edengamer23 said:
Ive started the game and think the same yeah. Though the 1st region so far is alright. I saw you have to go through the fairly long tutorial to get to Fontaine though lol, and other regions. Im trying to go fast but still enjoying the opening hours quite a bit.
Click to expand...
Yeah the first are is essentially a large Greta Plautus, fun but en you go back you realize there’s nothing there.
 
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I would definitely love to see a seafaring/aquatic turn for the next game after botw focus on the surface and totk the skies and underground.

I don't want them to flood hyrule tho, much rather they have the game be about Link, Zelda, and maybe a few others sailing to a new area. Even if the area was flooded it would feel too same, I really want a new area to explore for the first game. Love this version of hyrule but it's time for a change of pace.
 
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There are 2 zelda games about seafaring and I'm not particularly a fan of either of them so I'm not a fan of this direction. That said if they rectify the issues I had with WW/PH I'd be down with it, even if it seems regressive from an aesthetic perspective.
 
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I am on board too.

I hope they'd include a lost sunken civilization.
When I played Abzu and reached the underwater city, I wanted it to be a Zelda game with non-linear exploration and good puzzles.
It was so gorgeous and atmospheric.

BotW/TotK and Subnautica are some of my favorite games ever so yeah, I'm in.
 
Sure, I'd like the next Zelda to be kind of a spiritual successor of Wind Waker, but at the same time fully embracing BOTW / TOTK design philosophies.
Additionally, if I had to make a very specific wishlist
  • Great focus on water physics for both traversal and enviromental puzzles
  • The paraglider to take into account wind speed, direction and turbolence
  • A method of (water) traversal where you use the paraglider as a sort of kite surf
    (in other words, this next Zelda would also incorporate some essence of Pilotwings and Waverace)
  • (as suggested by Tall Valley Nerd earlier) A world map made of an archipelago of big islands. I would add, islands with a lot of verticality.
  • Keep something similar to sky islands, but substitute the underworld with deep sea exploration (which could also be directly linked to underground caves).
  • Art style similar to BOTW/TOTK but just slightly more detailed and realistic.
Additional note (edit):
I don't know if I'm the only one thinking this, I always found Link kind of a "stiff" character, especially in comparison to other main Nintendo characters like Mario, DK and even Samus (in her Metorid Dread rendition). I get it Zelda is a different genre, but I would also like them to give Link some more weight and momentum to his moveset.
 
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