TV Stranger Things 4 Discussion Thread (OPEN SPOILERS)

[Christo750]

STRANGER THINGS 4 (2022)
VOLUME 1 - May 27th, 2022
VOLUME 2 - July 1st, 2022

Produced by the Duffer Brothers
Written by the Duffer Brothers, Caitlin Schneiderhan, Paul Dichter, Kate Trefry, and Curtis Gwinn
Directed by the Duffer Brothers, Shawn Levy, and Nimród Antal



So after a nearly 3-year gap, Stranger Things 4 is out, or at least Volume 1 of Stranger Things 4 is out. It is the penultimate season, season 5 being the last. Volume 2 is coming July 1st, and will total about 4 hours between just two episodes.

I'm not super good at making bigger franchise threads like this so I hope this will suffice. If anyone else wants to make one who is better at it, please be my guest.

This is meant to serve as an introduction; my next post will be my overall thoughts about the season.

THERE WILL BE OPEN SPOILERS AFTER THIS POINT SO PLEASE BE AWARE! It's a great season so far, so make sure you watch before you spoil some key things about the show and series as a whole.
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Spoilers are up!

 

[Christo750]

This is easily the best season since season 1, though I do feel like the show has never been able to recapture what was so special about it.

It's also the most brutal. Chrissy's death at the end of the season premiere really took me by surprise with how gruesome it was. That style of death is also losing its luster with how many times it happens to relative no-names, which leads me to my biggest criticism of the season (and the show as a whole at this point). The more this show goes on, and the more perilous the situations get, and the more these kids just easily escape these horrible situations, the less impactful they feel, and the more the show has felt like it's going through the motions...

...which is why at the end of "Dear Billy", I really thought Max shouldn't have made it. I love the character and I love what she adds to the dynamic, but it also would've given a much greater sense of urgency to the goings-on of the season after that point. I love that the US army is this intense so early on, and how things kinda went to shit really quickly, but episodes 4-6 see little consequence happening to the main cast.

(Plus, the "she got saved by her favorite song" nonsense was soooo corny and almost cringeworthy.)

Okay here's where it gets super spoiler-y.

The reveal that Victor Creel's son is the one who killed his mother and sister, and was 001, as well as Vecna, is a reeeeally good twist that should've been alluded to way earlier on. I'm rewatching the series and am halfway through season 2 and it's kinda awesome to see the similarities and parallels between seasons 1 and 4. It casts a whole new light on everything that makes it interesting. Makes all of these things seeking out Eleven make a lot of sense; even the Mind Flayer seeking out Will in Season 2.

Excited to see how things shape up in Volume 2, but I worry that it's just going to be the same song and dance. Eddie Munson will likely be the only sacrifice. The gang narrowly escapes danger yet again, and brutal monsters wind up killing everyone except the same people that are actively seeking the danger out.

 

[Awesomegames23]

This is easily the best season since season 1, though I do feel like the show has never been able to recapture what was so special about it.

It's also the most brutal. Chrissy's death at the end of the season premiere really took me by surprise with how gruesome it was. That style of death is also losing its luster with how many times it happens to relative no-names, which leads me to my biggest criticism of the season (and the show as a whole at this point). The more this show goes on, and the more perilous the situations get, and the more these kids just easily escape these horrible situations, the less impactful they feel, and the more the show has felt like it's going through the motions...

...which is why at the end of "Dear Billy", I really thought Max shouldn't have made it. I love the character and I love what she adds to the dynamic, but it also would've given a much greater sense of urgency to the goings-on of the season after that point. I love that the US army is this intense so early on, and how things kinda went to shit really quickly, but episodes 4-6 see little consequence happening to the main cast.

(Plus, the "she got saved by her favorite song" nonsense was soooo corny and almost cringeworthy.)

Okay here's where it gets super spoiler-y.

The reveal that Victor Creel's son is the one who killed his mother and sister, and was 001, as well as Vecna, is a reeeeally good twist that should've been alluded to way earlier on. I'm rewatching the series and am halfway through season 2 and it's kinda awesome to see the similarities and parallels between seasons 1 and 4. It casts a whole new light on everything that makes it interesting. Makes all of these things seeking out Eleven make a lot of sense; even the Mind Flayer seeking out Will in Season 2.

Excited to see how things shape up in Volume 2, but I worry that it's just going to be the same song and dance. Eddie Munson will likely be the only sacrifice. The gang narrowly escapes danger yet again, and brutal monsters wind up killing everyone except the same people that are actively seeking the danger out.

I agree, twist was great, and it was a story more explained than shown unfortunately, but it kept you guessing to the very end. Overall, I like it better than season 2 and 3, story isn’t as good as season 1 but it definitely the most epic.

I think someone is going to die at the end of the season, I have a feeling it will look like Steve is going to die, but then Nancy might jump in to save Steve (I think Eddie’s words foreshadow this I.e. jumping in to the lake without hesitation). I think Nancy will be saved in the next episode but die in the last episode.

 

[Weebos]

This was an excellent season, my wife and I loved it.

Spoiler tagging something from the Part 2 Teaser:

Spoiler: Season 4 Part 2 Teaser Trailer

I was excited to see the Mind Flayer in the teaser, it looks like they got captured by the Russians. I'm curious to see how that will shake up and if it will set up Season 5.

 

[Sadist]

Honestly I love the Max scene; yes, it has a certain amount of cheese, but damn if that cheese ain’t delicious and I’m filling up on it. Running up that Hill has been stuck in my mind for days now ha.

Really hope no one dies; I know, some people feel it’s needed, but I’m seeing discussion online on Steve biting it and I’m like “no, Steve is my dude, stay the fudge away you Upside down dwellers.” Out of all the characters Steve has so much chemistry with everyone; with Robin (the ‘I like boobies, you like boobies’ discussion with her had me chuckling all the way), to Dustin, to even Nancy, Max and Eddie.

Really captivated by this season.

 

[JazzPotatoes]

Loved the Hawkins storyline: the new villain is great, the characters here all have something to do, and I love how much they've been leaning into out and out horror this time round. Billy's been the star of the show, that scene in Episode 4 was fantastic.

Less keen on the California plot: it feels like Will has once again been pushed to the background, and I don't even know what's happening with Jonathan's arc at this point.

Joyce and Murray: what's even going on here??? In season one, Joyce felt like an emotionally exhausted mother who was still pulling absolutely everything together because she simply could not live without trying to do everything to look after her kids. It was relatively grounded, dramatic storytelling.

Now, her and Murray are getting into Uncharted style plane setpieces with karate and crash landings in Russia, after spending all of one scene with her kids this season? They're infiltrating secret Russian prisons? What?

I don't know if it's Murray as a character just throwing Joyce's storyline off the rails, or if it's actor availability issues which mean all these story arcs are now happening completely divorced from each other, but it's getting a bit much. Season three was already pushing it with the "Secret Russian base staffed by morons" arc, and this is just more of that.

So yeah: strong main storyline that is carrying a lot of more mediocre side stories along with it.

 

[Christo750]

Loved the Hawkins storyline: the new villain is great, the characters here all have something to do, and I love how much they've been leaning into out and out horror this time round. Billy's been the star of the show, that scene in Episode 4 was fantastic.

Less keen on the California plot: it feels like Will has once again been pushed to the background, and I don't even know what's happening with Jonathan's arc at this point.

Joyce and Murray: what's even going on here??? In season one, Joyce felt like an emotionally exhausted mother who was still pulling absolutely everything together because she simply could not live without trying to do everything to look after her kids. It was relatively grounded, dramatic storytelling.

Now, her and Murray are getting into Uncharted style plane setpieces with karate and crash landings in Russia, after spending all of one scene with her kids this season? They're infiltrating secret Russian prisons? What?

I don't know if it's Murray as a character just throwing Joyce's storyline off the rails, or if it's actor availability issues which mean all these story arcs are now happening completely divorced from each other, but it's getting a bit much. Season three was already pushing it with the "Secret Russian base staffed by morons" arc, and this is just more of that.

So yeah: strong main storyline that is carrying a lot of more mediocre side stories along with it.

YES. I love Murray, but their arc is bewildering. This is what I'm talking about by toothless; that these people can just effortlessly seek out these dangerous situations and come out of them relatively unscathed.

Russian prison kills anybody and everybody except for...single mother and her PI friend actively looking for it?

Vecna's curse kills anybody and everybody who feels guilt, except for....small skateboarding child who likes a song a lot?

The Hawkins Lab people actually felt dangerous to the kids and Eleven in season 1, especially considering their families' complete disinterest, minus Joyce, obviously. That was the big payoff when they were cornered in the middle school and Eleven made them bleed out of their eyes. It was badass and it raised the stakes to a believable level of 80's sci-fi cheese. Even Hopper persevering in the prison is believable because they sell him being a badass.

This season is a total redemption for Hopper btw. I hated the Homer Simpson treatment he got in season 3.

 

[Crusters]

Really enjoyed this season.

I really liked how they began implying 001 was Vecna in the secret lab flash back, making it it irrevocably known as he was shown to be the one that conducted the slaughter, and then was banished to the other side.... But that also made his lengthy monologue/flashback of him as a kid just beating the crap out of that horse after we already figured it out pretty pointless and boring.

 

[Deleted member 2670]

Somehow, despite growing list of characters, locations and antagonists, the first seven episodes kept it together. Together like I could follow all of the plotlines and character arcs, which is a feat.

No judgement until the last two release, which will be over 4 (FOUR) hours of ST content.

 

[Tendou]

I really really loved this season!

But man Max would have been shit out of luck if her favorite song was a RUSH song

 

[Christo750]

Rewatching the series up to rewatching Volume 1, and I kinda love the parallels that season 4 has to season 1.

I was also way harder on season 2 back then. Minus the one awful episode with Kali (who btw, is noticeably not in any of the scenes with the kids, nor is 008 ever referred to, aside from the flashbacks with eleven's mother finding them), it's actually a pretty cool season. Noah Schnapp is quite the actor in the season. Season 3 on its own is really lackluster. Everyone and everything is very goofy and the tone has completely been lost and it's basically one huge ad for '80s nostalgia.

Seasons 2 and 3 would've worked better as two volumes of the same season. Cut a lot of the fluff from both and make one bigger season. Separately, they feel very redundant.

 

[Red Monster]

I really really loved this season!

But man Max would have been shit out of luck if her favorite song was a RUSH song

My username back at the old place is TwntyOneTwlv, and I’m feeling very offended right now! lol jk

 

[Brofield]

Honestly this season getting the HBO levels of money has been well worth the investment. Vecna's reveal was stunning and I absolutely cannot wait to rewatch the series and see how it's led to him. If Covid delayed S4's production so they could spend more time fleshing out the writing, it's definitely been worth it.

Also, I realize they're slowly alluding more and more to Will Byers coming out of the closet, but honestly what cinched it for me was him holding that Alan Turing poster for his personal hero project.

 

[maidhhc]

Could Will's painting be of something other than Mike? Of Vecna? Could Will have been originally abducted by Vecna and not the Demogorgon ( who was never shown). Whatever kidnapped him had Telekinesis and could open his locked door with its mind.

 

[maidhhc]

I think the fundamental question now is why the Upside Down is fixed on the date that Will was captured - I'm sure there's some sort of twist building there.

 

[Christo750]

Just finished season 3…I’m a little confused now.

Upside Down works as a hivemind. The Mind Flayer (through Billy) only seems to recognize Eleven as the one who shut the gate on him in season 2. But then says to Eleven “we’ve been building it; all of this is for you”.

But in season 4, Vecna says he never forgets a kill. Alluding to the fact that he knew Barbara died? And he knew Billy as well, as he toyed with Max’s memory. And 001 knows Eleven, obviously. So Vecna and the Mind Flayer are two separate beings? Or is Vecna the Mind Flayer? Either way, if this works as a hivemind as intended, how did the Mind Flayer not know about Eleven prior to season 2?

 

[Earthbounder]

I think the fundamental question now is why the Upside Down is fixed on the date that Will was captured - I'm sure there's some sort of twist building there.

I read that is something which will only be answered next season.

 

[hologram]

I couldn't disagree more about the Max scene in Dear Billy. I think Dear Billy is one of the strongest episodes of the entire series, and the escape sequence at the end was excellent. I also think Sadie Sink has been given much more to do this season and been a standout actor, so it would have really bothered me if they killed her off before the halfway mark. I do get what you mean about the plot armor of the main characters having plot armor, but I feel that's somewhat unavoidable in this kind of show.

 

[Christo750]

I couldn't disagree more about the Max scene in Dear Billy. I think Dear Billy is one of the strongest episodes of the entire series, and the escape sequence at the end was excellent. I also think Sadie Sink has been given much more to do this season and been a standout actor, so it would have really bothered me if they killed her off before the halfway mark. I do get what you mean about the plot armor of the main characters having plot armor, but I feel that's somewhat unavoidable in this kind of show.

Trying to explain it without being a run-on sentence, but I think it was unavoidable for the cast in the beginning when their fantasy lives were so heavily juxtaposed with their normal school lives. In season 1, they found their bravery in dealing with a problem that they uniquely used their knowledge of D&D to help them explain what was happening. It was a reasonably grounded peril, and despite the danger, I think deep down, those characters loved it. But then as they kept going into seasons 2-4, the show never struck that same balance. I appreciated how over time they moved past worrying about bullies, but like, when you've stopped a secret government plot to experiment on children, what do you care about fitting into high school? The amount of danger these characters effortlessly navigate with no consequences completely ruins the immersion and makes me never question again whether or not anything will happen to anyone. The Upside Down has nearly killed Hopper a few times now, and the biggest bad of them all is about to kill Max (which the show all but confirms in a so-far useless plot device of writing letters to everybody) and the power of MUSIC lets her run and escape a cascade of rubble being thrown at her and she makes it out perfectly fine? The army literally shoots up the Byers' house, killing an agent and severely wounding another, but these kids make it out fine? Murray and Joyce get essentially trafficked to Russia, somehow survive a crash in a hollowed-out cargo plane, and go into the most secret most dangerous Russian PRISON on Earth and they are FINE? Literally fine. Their journey isn't impeded at all. The plot armor isn't just somewhere, it's EVERYWHERE with these characters. And it's definitely avoidable if this show actually had any semblance of real danger. And while I do love the direction the show is taking, and I still love smaller character moments (because at the end of the day these are great characters), it has completely lost its impact on me.

 

[eli]

Trying to explain it without being a run-on sentence, but I think it was unavoidable for the cast in the beginning when their fantasy lives were so heavily juxtaposed with their normal school lives. In season 1, they found their bravery in dealing with a problem that they uniquely used their knowledge of D&D to help them explain what was happening. It was a reasonably grounded peril, and despite the danger, I think deep down, those characters loved it. But then as they kept going into seasons 2-4, the show never struck that same balance. I appreciated how over time they moved past worrying about bullies, but like, when you've stopped a secret government plot to experiment on children, what do you care about fitting into high school? The amount of danger these characters effortlessly navigate with no consequences completely ruins the immersion and makes me never question again whether or not anything will happen to anyone. The Upside Down has nearly killed Hopper a few times now, and the biggest bad of them all is about to kill Max (which the show all but confirms in a so-far useless plot device of writing letters to everybody) and the power of MUSIC lets her run and escape a cascade of rubble being thrown at her and she makes it out perfectly fine? The army literally shoots up the Byers' house, killing an agent and severely wounding another, but these kids make it out fine? Murray and Joyce get essentially trafficked to Russia, somehow survive a crash in a hollowed-out cargo plane, and go into the most secret most dangerous Russian PRISON on Earth and they are FINE? Literally fine. Their journey isn't impeded at all. The plot armor isn't just somewhere, it's EVERYWHERE with these characters. And it's definitely avoidable if this show actually had any semblance of real danger. And while I do love the direction the show is taking, and I still love smaller character moments (because at the end of the day these are great characters), it has completely lost its impact on me.

It went from enjoyable and investing to just enjoyable. It's a fun show, but not one I care about.

 

[maidhhc]

Trying to explain it without being a run-on sentence, but I think it was unavoidable for the cast in the beginning when their fantasy lives were so heavily juxtaposed with their normal school lives. In season 1, they found their bravery in dealing with a problem that they uniquely used their knowledge of D&D to help them explain what was happening. It was a reasonably grounded peril, and despite the danger, I think deep down, those characters loved it. But then as they kept going into seasons 2-4, the show never struck that same balance. I appreciated how over time they moved past worrying about bullies, but like, when you've stopped a secret government plot to experiment on children, what do you care about fitting into high school? The amount of danger these characters effortlessly navigate with no consequences completely ruins the immersion and makes me never question again whether or not anything will happen to anyone. The Upside Down has nearly killed Hopper a few times now, and the biggest bad of them all is about to kill Max (which the show all but confirms in a so-far useless plot device of writing letters to everybody) and the power of MUSIC lets her run and escape a cascade of rubble being thrown at her and she makes it out perfectly fine? The army literally shoots up the Byers' house, killing an agent and severely wounding another, but these kids make it out fine? Murray and Joyce get essentially trafficked to Russia, somehow survive a crash in a hollowed-out cargo plane, and go into the most secret most dangerous Russian PRISON on Earth and they are FINE? Literally fine. Their journey isn't impeded at all. The plot armor isn't just somewhere, it's EVERYWHERE with these characters. And it's definitely avoidable if this show actually had any semblance of real danger. And while I do love the direction the show is taking, and I still love smaller character moments (because at the end of the day these are great characters), it has completely lost its impact on me.

What has ruined the immersion for me is that they rarely hold two minutes of tension without interrupting or puncturing it with a joke or quip.

That being said, Season 4 so far is miles better than S3 in my eyes.

 

[Clix]

Just finished the Dear Billy episode, and don't get the hype about it from social media. It was fine? This season has been hit or miss for me. When it is strong, it is strong, but when it is low... it is low. Also, as a big Kate Bush song, and reading the discourse on Twitter, does no one actually know what that song is about? lol

I don't mind plot armor in a show like this since it is sniping a lot from 80's adventure movies and serials. And I am fine with it, because I feel the tone of what the series should be and what it does 70 percent of the time... it works. But then there is the 30 percent which tonally feels very off and the show gets nasty. Like, my daughter wants to watch it with me, but like, no. This show apes from very specific type of shows and movies, but it gets suddenly too nasty and violent, not really fitting the tone that they are going for, that I told her when she is a little older. Like, I don't want to sound like a stick in the mud, but I wish the show actually kept a solid PG-13 rating. Season 1 was better in that regards, which is why it is the strongest season, but the tone of this show is all over the place. Sorry if it makes me sound like a stick in the mud, especially from someone that would sneak away at 8 to catch Nightmare on Elm Street 4 on cable while everyone was sleeping lol I just wish they made this more appropriate for youngins, because at the end of the day, they do try to market it to them as well.

As for the new season, the editing is all over the place and plot inconsistencies are abound. That bothers me more than plot armor, that I am in favor of this series having.

 

[Mbolibombo]

Trailer for the last two episodes and holy moly - it's definitely has that epic feeling over it.
Definitely spoilery, so dont watch if you want to go in blind.

As for the Dear Billy discourse here, it's one of the episodes that I will bear with me to the end of times. Best TV I ever saw.

 

[Christo750]

Trailer for the last two episodes and holy moly - it's definitely has that epic feeling over it.
Definitely spoilery, so dont watch if you want to go in blind.

As for the Dear Billy discourse here, it's one of the episodes that I will bear with me to the end of times. Best TV I ever saw.

It’s a good teaser. Can’t wait for these scenarios to have zero consequence!

I also read somewhere that Kate Bush owns 100% of the songwriting, licensing and publishing for Running Up That Hill so she’s been making about a million a week since the first volume came out. Good for her.

 

[Illucio]

This season had some great writing and I feel like every character got their due. Thematically I'm just bored with the villain behind it all and everything to do with the Upside Down now. There just doesn't feel like there is anything new to tell anymore. Yet we are getting another season and it's just... Boring.

The Russian plot was fun but felt like the weakest and smacked on adventure. But the writing was great and was probably the funniest moments in this season was from the pilot.

California Surfer Pizza Driver Stoner guy was the best possible character they could add to the formula. It just works so damn well.

Nancy just DRIVES the story in Hawkins. She is the certified leader and gets so much accomplished even with the tiniest of info. Dustin figures so much out and is a certified genius just like his girlfriend. And making a character who became a rock legend and wanted Dustin to look up to him and be called a hero just like Steve. chef kiss

I'm just a little upset Steve doesn't embrace his best mom title. I really want to see him groom all the boys to look their best, raise them and be the perfect bigger brother figure for everyone. With Will coming back to Hawkins at the end of the last episode, I really hope he gives Will a makeover and help Will come out. (Will is Gay right? This is like the 5th or 6th time they hinted at it in the show's run).

 

[Obsonet]

This season had some great writing and I feel like every character got their due. Thematically I'm just bored with the villain behind it all and everything to do with the Upside Down now. There just doesn't feel like there is anything new to tell anymore. Yet we are getting another season and it's just... Boring.

The Russian plot was fun but felt like the weakest and smacked on adventure. But the writing was great and was probably the funniest moments in this season was from the pilot.

California Surfer Pizza Driver Stoner guy was the best possible character they could add to the formula. It just works so damn well.

Nancy just DRIVES the story in Hawkins. She is the certified leader and gets so much accomplished even with the tiniest of info. Dustin figures so much out and is a certified genius just like his girlfriend. And making a character who became a rock legend and wanted Dustin to look up to him and be called a hero just like Steve. chef kiss

I'm just a little upset Steve doesn't embrace his best mom title. I really want to see him groom all the boys to look their best, raise them and be the perfect bigger brother figure for everyone. With Will coming back to Hawkins at the end of the last episode, I really hope he gives Will a makeover and help Will come out. (Will is Gay right? This is like the 5th or 6th time they hinted at it in the show's run).

Yeah and in love with Mike
I thought he was gonna tell his brother about it but I guess that’ll be next season

 

[Leo]

Great season and all but ugh I'm so tired of "hinting" about being gay.

Like, please straight up just say your character is gay if they are. We need all the visibility we can get, this "we don't need to label things" is PR bullshit

 

[aus89]

Great season and all but ugh I'm so tired of "hinting" about being gay.

Like, please straight up just say your character is gay if they are. We need all the visibility we can get, this "we don't need to label things" is PR bullshit

I mean I understand it's the 80s etc... so coming out isn't really something Will might necessarily be comfortable doing and his love is seemingly unrequited and maybe there'll be a hot guy for him in S5? but given this is Stranger Things' cartoony version of the 80s, and Robin is allowed to be fairly open all things considered and Mike, Lucas, El and Max are allowed to be romantic - it does seem like what we see in games a lot where same sex female romance is more acceptable than male (even the painting thing which was sold as this thing that Will had painted for Mike and was meaningful to their relationship etc... was undercut by being about all their friends and how Eleven asked him to draw it) - yeah it's annoying

 

[RustyRascal]

Just finished last night. I enjoyed it while also finding lots of it average or bad. The pacing was shocking, far too long with parts too dragged out. Wills love for Mike just felt odd, partly because I think the actor was terrible at selling it. The lack of deaths and the fact it was only really new characters that did die.. was disappointing. Hated most of the Russia storyline but Hoppers cool.

But also I did enjoy it, honest 😂 I still like most of the characters and the Whole Vecna fight was an entertaining watch

 

[RustyRascal]

Great season and all but ugh I'm so tired of "hinting" about being gay.

Like, please straight up just say your character is gay if they are. We need all the visibility we can get, this "we don't need to label things" is PR bullshit

I feel like it wasn't subtle enough to be honest. I know there's been hints before but the finale fleet like they were trying so hard to say it without saying it that it became annoying. It felt overplayed and underdeveloped

 

[Leo]

I mean I understand it's the 80s etc... so coming out isn't really something Will might necessarily be comfortable doing and his love is seemingly unrequited and maybe there'll be a hot guy for him in S5? but given this is Stranger Things' cartoony version of the 80s, and Robin is allowed to be fairly open all things considered and Mike, Lucas, El and Max are allowed to be romantic - it does seem like what we see in games a lot where same sex female romance is more acceptable than male (even the painting thing which was sold as this thing that Will had painted for Mike and was meaningful to their relationship etc... was undercut by being about all their friends and how Eleven asked him to draw it) - yeah it's annoying

I feel like it wasn't subtle enough to be honest. I know there's been hints before but the finale fleet like they were trying so hard to say it without saying it that it became annoying. It felt overplayed and underdeveloped

I think my frustration is because this subplot had been hanging since S3. Then it was subtle and that's okay, it was something that would be resolved on the next season. But now we have another season and the gay character barely gets any development over two seasons, while other characters get to have their arcs. That just feels like they're afraid to shock the audiences by giving it the emphasis it should have. To make it worse, being maybe gay is Will's whole plot right now, he has nothing else going for him. So at least flesh it out and do it right. I understand it's the 80s and he's a scared kid, but he could have opened up to his brother or to Eleven if that had been given enough screentime, it would feel natural.

 

[RustyRascal]

I think my frustration is because this subplot had been hanging since S3. Then it was subtle and that's okay, it was something that would be resolved on the next season. But now we have another season and the gay character barely gets any development over two seasons, while other characters get to have their arcs. That just feels like they're afraid to shock the audiences by giving it the emphasis it should have. To make it worse, being maybe gay is Will's whole plot right now, he has nothing else going for him. So at least flesh it out and do it right. I understand it's the 80s and he's a scared kid, but he could have opened up to his brother or to Eleven if that had been given enough screentime, it would feel natural.

Yeah, the brother stuff that happened in the finale should have happened sooner. Completely agree it needed fleshed out more, when I said about subtle I suppose I mean build it up more. Was barely an arc all season then on the finale they ramped it up. Hopefully though that's it set up for s5 and we'll see a worthwhile result

 

[Christo750]

Holy shit that finale did not need to be 2 and a half hours long. I know this isn’t true on paper but it really feels like not a whole lot happened.

Interesting scenarios and good cinematography to show Eleven as the threat she is (also admittedly a dope shot of Vecna forming the Mind Flayer) but I swear to god it’s like they wrote these scripts in an afternoon. Terrible dialogue between Eleven and Vecna.
“You have already lost.”
“No…YOU have.”
🤮
That whole sequence was so drawn out. The fight itself was them force pushing each other 2 or 3 times each over the course of 40 minutes.

They’re lack of commitment to Will being gay is annoying. I don’t mind a slower approach to it but this is a snail’s pace. He had what felt like 15 minutes of on-screen development the whole season and it just was not enough.

Hopper fighting the demogorgan and chopping its head off was neat. I loved him and Joyce in the last two episodes. His reunion with Eleven was really sweet. His reunion with Mike was even sweet. He was really great this season all around. Murray was excellent. The whole Russian prison plot line was still the most goofy shit and most nonsensical plot line.

I honestly feel bad about shitting on the show so much because I did enjoy watching it at times, but it’s so predictable, it has completely unearned any tension it previously had. Fake-outs upon fake-outs upon fake-outs. They make a plan. They do the plan. The plan doesn’t look like it’s going to work, then it works, then it stops working then it works again, then an actual twist happens. Then that gets undone. Then, based on the last shot, the undo got undone? I really don’t understand what’s going on at the end of the episode. It’s trying to be a red hearing like season 1’s but that was at least explainable. As far as I can tell, nothing actually happened to make the Upside Down cross over.

I feel like I would’ve taken 4 more hours in this season, kept Max’s death, had 2-3 more episodes of them fighting the Upside Down monsters in Hawkins, and calling it a wrap on the series. Idk how you’re going to add another 10 hours of television to this.

 

[aus89]

I think my frustration is because this subplot had been hanging since S3. Then it was subtle and that's okay, it was something that would be resolved on the next season. But now we have another season and the gay character barely gets any development over two seasons, while other characters get to have their arcs. That just feels like they're afraid to shock the audiences by giving it the emphasis it should have. To make it worse, being maybe gay is Will's whole plot right now, he has nothing else going for him. So at least flesh it out and do it right. I understand it's the 80s and he's a scared kid, but he could have opened up to his brother or to Eleven if that had been given enough screentime, it would feel natural.

Agreed. Its really been hanging since S1 (kids calling him gay etc...) and the “gay coming out” storyline has been played out at this point, so yeah its disappointing they're trying to make it a big "moment", even with all the repeated rainbow references and stuff like him choosing Alan Turing as his hero at school in CA. Not to mention, making the male gay character pine and cry over the straight guy who will never love him and generally having no use to the plot in the meantime. Without wanting to assume anything, the writers room doesn't seem like it has any gay people involved in writing as far as i can tell. It's all pretty by the numbers, "don't upset the republicans" stuff.

I'll just leave you on this note...

 

[Sadist]

I liked it.

Yeah yeah, some things didn’t quite work or was a bit dragged out, still, it’s good television.

Some random thoughts;

- Vecna being the big bad all along came a bit as a surprise. When he explained that he came to the Upside Down and kind of gave the Mindflayer its form while exploring at first I thought “yeah like these creatures will allow that to happen”, but Will confirming that it were his thoughts he heard when the mindflayer got to him… oof.

- Damnit Eddie you were the chosen one. Love the guy; from searching music and screaming “THIS IS MUSIC” while holding an Iron Maiden tape, to him and Dustin bonding… with the amazing moment that he played Master of Puppets was glorious. His death though

- Nancy is like the biggest badass out of all of them? Shame about not going for the head.

- Lucas was killing it with the Max scenes at the end.

- Speaking of Max… jeeeez. Her death felt powerful, so returning felt a bit cheap; however, that scene where she tell Lucas that she doesn’t want to die, brutal.

- Mike was actually useful this time around. If he puts his stupid teen shit aside, he’s a pretty decent dude.

- Okay, who laughed when Jason got BBQ’d? I know I did.

- Brenner getting the cold shoulder from El at the end was oddly satisfying.

- The ending though… I need more. Hurry up

 

[Awesomegames23]

Ssuurrffss up my dudes.

 

[JazzPotatoes]

"Sweet, we finally managed to escape that Russian prison."

"Yeah, but Hop: Netflix Head Office have just called. They spent a lot of money making the set for that Russian prison. A lot of money."

"Well in that case, we'd better go back and do the same thing all over again. Can't have that set going to waste, can we."

 

[Sejes]

yeah that mid season climax was the peak. the last two episodes were surprisingly clunky

 

[Earthbounder]

I really liked it!

I have read lots of complaints regarding Max being resurrected, but I think that's going to have some sort of dark consequence when the next season comes around. I am betting on the character not having a happy ending and maybe dying for good, because the whole thing came off as Eleven doing something she should not have done.

Plus, we still have those letters Max wrote for everyone. They remain unopened, so I feel they will be used for dramatic effect in the future.

 

[Lord Azrael]

Ragnarok is coming

 

[Christo750]

I really liked it!

I have read lots of complaints regarding Max being resurrected, but I think that's going to have some sort of dark consequence when the next season comes around. I am betting on the character not having a happy ending and maybe dying for good, because the whole thing came off as Eleven doing something she should not have done.

Plus, we still have those letters Max wrote for everyone. They remain unopened, so I feel they will be used for dramatic effect in the future.

Oh yeah, we do. Very weird that was never capitalized on. It also feels so long ago, which is why I can’t even talk about this show as episodes. It feels like hours now. There were 2 fake-outs to Max’s death, almost

We also never learned how Brenner survived in season 1.

 

[lexony]

Finished it tonight.
I really liked that Kate Bush x Stranger Things Theme Remix.
The visuals are insane and I really enjoyed the episodes, I just didn't like the slow pacing of the story. The length of the last episode and the back and forth with everyone stuck until Eleven is defeating Vecna was just a bit to much to me. I'm actually looking forward the last season supposedly being shorter.
But overall really cool, still my favorite Netflix Series. Though Season 3 will stay as my favorite season.

 

[Lord Azrael]

I thought the finale was just alright. They need to stop trying to sell El as badass though. There's only so much repetitive screaming with outstretched hand to background synth music I can take before I start to check out. Easily the most boring character

Speaking of which. The larger and larger they go with the scale, the less and less it makes sense that a random group of kids manages to win/get by safely each time. Like damn we're in planet level government conspiracy territory and the only ones who can stop it are these kids? I like their individual stories so I'm not advocating they replace that, but then if that's what they wanted to focus on then the stakes and scale needed to remain a lot more personal

And of course once again the only characters that die are a couple of newly introduced ones. Eddie got done dirty. And on top of that the Max fakeout. I even don't like how they wrote off Jason. His moments were some of the most tense this season. It seems like they felt they wrote themselves into a corner where they couldn't redeem him, but also couldn't keep him around because he'd be a persistent problem. So they just killed him off and tied it all up in a convenient little bow. Would've been much more interesting to keep him around; if you need him out of the picture for a bit just have him recovering in the hospital

It's a shame it went that way with Jason when they had a much better handled example in Yuri the very same season. Both started out as characters with their own motivations and agency, throwing a wrench into everything left and right, but only one of them got written out like a plot device that's run its use

I will say on the topic of Jason though, really made the police look like incompetent buffoons. They basically instigated a vigilante lynch mob with their cavalier questioning. And didn't even have the sense to stop Jason when he was up on the podium. Oh well, true to real life I guess

 

[MaitreWakou]

Aww man, I'm so disappointed in this season.

For me, each new season had been better than the previous one.
Absolutely loved season 3 for the incredible balance between each group, and for its very fun story toying with the cold war's communist paranoia in the US (the communists are actually hidden within the capitalism's church : the mall ! So much fun)

But in this one, the groups felt so unbalanced to me. Jim's story in the gulag straight up felt useless. Never thought he would spend the whole season in there lmao.
Mike, Will and co, despite being a fun group thanks to pizza dude, is 100% useless until the very last episode.
And was very disappointed to, once again, going back to some "Eleven's life in the lab" flashbacks. And it never ended, by far the most boring moments of the season for me. Where the character started in this season had so much potential ! She, a girl who never experienced a normal life, is trying to live one at the place where people will tear you apart if you don't fall into their societal standards : the high school ! But it didn't last long, and didn't even had any real conclusion. Early on the season, I was wondering what would happen between Eleven and her bully by the end of the season. Will they bond ? Will they confront again ? Oh well, nothing actually lmao.


As for the good points, as always, some fun new characters. Eddie is indeed very cool, but his death was predictable from the beginning because we watched the other seasons and his character fell into the "this weirdo man is actually very cool and you know he will die a hero" category. Could have been such a great addition as a permanent member of the gang for the final season.

Pizza dude was a great new addition because he's an antithesis of all the other usual new characters the show introduce. Having a guy who is basically just a stoner pizzeria employee was great. Not much more, no secret dark past, no hidden pain within him, just a stoner and a good friend, that's it, lmao.

Jason was a good villain, a very believable menace. When he was around, you knew shit was about to go down. And I join Lord Azrael's feeling of how they wrote him off. You don't kill off one of your season's villain like that, that felt very cheap. I agree with the sentiment that it feels like the writters didn't really know where to go with him. They probably made him too much of a menace for their own good lol. Would have been cool to keep him for the final season.


Anyway, I hope the final season will be good. As long as they bring back a good balance between the groups (make them all useful to the plot and make them all participate to the main mystery and it'll be already a good point !) it should be fine.

 

[ProteusRidley]

Season started off strong, got super weak by the end of it. Such an incredibly predictable season too. And that 2h 19m long episode. Jesus christ make it two episodes or cut out something.

That was middling, and I'm not sure I'll finish the show.

 

[Christo750]

Aww man, I'm so disappointed in this season.

For me, each new season had been better than the previous one.
Absolutely loved season 3 for the incredible balance between each group, and for its very fun story toying with the cold war's communist paranoia in the US (the communists are actually hidden within the capitalism's church : the mall ! So much fun)

But in this one, the groups felt so unbalanced to me. Jim's story in the gulag straight up felt useless. Never thought he would spend the whole season in there lmao.
Mike, Will and co, despite being a fun group thanks to pizza dude, is 100% useless until the very last episode.
And was very disappointed to, once again, going back to some "Eleven's life in the lab" flashbacks. And it never ended, by far the most boring moments of the season for me. Where the character started in this season had so much potential ! She, a girl who never experienced a normal life, is trying to live one at the place where people will tear you apart if you don't fall into their societal standards : the high school ! But it didn't last long, and didn't even had any real conclusion. Early on the season, I was wondering what would happen between Eleven and her bully by the end of the season. Will they bond ? Will they confront again ? Oh well, nothing actually lmao.


As for the good points, as always, some fun new characters. Eddie is indeed very cool, but his death was predictable from the beginning because we watched the other seasons and his character fell into the "this weirdo man is actually very cool and you know he will die a hero" category. Could have been such a great addition as a permanent member of the gang for the final season.

Pizza dude was a great new addition because he's an antithesis of all the other usual new characters the show introduce. Having a guy who is basically just a stoner pizzeria employee was great. Not much more, no secret dark past, no hidden pain within him, just a stoner and a good friend, that's it, lmao.

Jason was a good villain, a very believable menace. When he was around, you knew shit was about to go down. And I join Lord Azrael's feeling of how they wrote him off. You don't kill off one of your season's villain like that, that felt very cheap. I agree with the sentiment that it feels like the writters didn't really know where to go with him. They probably made him too much of a menace for their own good lol. Would have been cool to keep him for the final season.


Anyway, I hope the final season will be good. As long as they bring back a good balance between the groups (make them all useful to the plot and make them all participate to the main mystery and it'll be already a good point !) it should be fine.

I actually have the opposite opinion on Jason's death. I love how he died; Lucas told him to go home, he couldn't see past his personal mission and ended up paying the ultimate price for it. It's one of the only things that felt like it happened with actual weight. The bigger problem IMO is the surrounding show. Things get completely undone and feel ultimately weightless throughout the season.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

As a rural Indiana dude I don't think I met anyone who was openly out until going to college in 2000, so teenagers stuck in the 80s keeping it as internal as possible seems pretty believable. I also didn't think Will was so obviously gay until this season, but my gaydar is kinda shitty.

 

[Mekanos]

I thought season 4 was an overall improvement from 3 but there's way too many characters and subplots and the episodes running forever doesn't help. Would honestly rather they chopped them up into 40-50 minute episodes, and cut the Russia subplot wholesale. I guess I'm glad it's ending next season because I feel like I'd run out of patience for the show otherwise. I've enjoyed it but it definitely feels like it's overstayed its welcome at this point. I definitely miss the simplicity of the first season and its smaller scope.

 

[Christo750]

I'm reading some theories that Will's crying scene is based on his knowledge of how tied he is to Vecna, and how he knows how far this whole thing is from being over.

There's speculation that the silhouette Will saw in S1 wasn't a Demogorgon, it was a less developed Vecna. I don't think that's true (I don't think the Duffer Brothers thought that far ahead) but it's certainly easily retconned.

As a rural Indiana dude I don't think I met anyone who was openly out until going to college in 2000, so teenagers stuck in the 80s keeping it as internal as possible seems pretty believable. I also didn't think Will was so obviously gay until this season, but my gaydar is kinda shitty.

I really didn't either, and now I'm at a point where I wonder if it's all fan's headcanon, due to my above point.