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News Sonic Origins releasing on June 23rd!

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Zellia

Bob-omb
Pronouns
They/them
The original tracks are the MJ ones, right? There are legal issues surrounding them now? Have the last rereleased of Sonic 3 use the PC songs instead?
So, I don't think anything is technically 100% confirmed, so some of this may be wrong, but afaik it's mostly correct (or at least what is understood to be correct).

The original tracks are what is in the prototype of Sonic 3 that was unearthed a few years ago. Then MJ and his collaborators came in and some music was replaced with their tracks (which includes stuff like Carnival Night, Ice Cap, Launch Base, and the Credits).

I don't think Sega have ever really publicly acknowledged there's a legal issue with these tracks, but that's the general understanding and it seems to be insanely complex. It's believed MJ wasn't happy with the audio hardware of the Mega Drive and pulled out of the project, leaving him uncredited but his tracks still in the game. Most rereleases of Sonic 3/S3&K are basically an emulated ROM of the original MD/Genesis release with the MJ music intact - it's not really clear if Sega had the rights to do this or if they simply weren't challenged on it legally, and it seems at some point they stopped even doing this after the 2011 Steam release.

The PC port from the 90s, on the other hand used MIDI music, dropping the various MJ tracks for the prototype versions (at the time, it wasn't clear if this was new music made especially to replace the MJ music or not, but the prototype Sonic 3 ROM proved that this music was implemented first and then replaced by the MJ music).

So the issue with Sonic Origins is that unless Sega have managed to resolve the legal issues with the MJ music, they will need to seek an alternative, and the most obvious solution is to use the prototype tracks.
 

V_ac

Rattata
Pronouns
He/Him
The original tracks are the MJ ones, right? There are legal issues surrounding them now? Have the last rereleased of Sonic 3 use the PC songs instead?
It's never been officially confirmed by anyone IIRC, but the general belief is that there's licensing issues related to the tracks MJ and his team worked on for the game that are the big reason the game hasn't gotten a rerelease in a long while.

The last rerelease (the Steam version from 2011) did use the MJ tracks, for the record.
 

chocolate_supra

Must proceed at a high velocity #TeamDecade
Pronouns
He/Him
FamiGold
-127
The Sega Ages emulation of Sonic 1 and 2 are both very good. The rest of your post is dead on though.
yeah, do not dis the M2 S1 and S2 currently on switch. taxman versions will be much appreciated but it's not like we're left suffering without them
Sorry, no disrespect intended. I just meant to distinguish that they were simply the emulated originals as opposed to ported natively with the extra features and updated aspect ratio. I probably shouldn't have used the m word. πŸ˜…

As far as the Sonic 3 music, I obviously have a lot of nostalgia for the tracks that would be missing, but I actually was gifted the Sonic & Knuckles Collection for PC in high school and so I have a little bit of weird, alternative nostalgia for the prototype tracks as well. I'm at a point now where if they did remove the tracks in question for the prototype music, I'd actually be okay with it. I kinda look forward to experiencing that weird little bit of alternative gaming music history.
 

CyberWolfJV

I talk more about games than I play them
Pronouns
He/Him
If they end using the prototype songs, I don't expect this will be well received by the general public; 90% of people who played these games remember the Genesis soundtrack, and not the PC ones;

I know you can always expect the Steam version of Origins to be modded to include the original music, but the console versions will remain with that sour spot.

Still.. better having Sonic 3&K rereleased with that alteration than not having it at all.. It's similar to Dragon Ball Z Super Butouden games that got rereleased with alternate soundtracks on 3DS and Switch.
 

MondoMega

Puffball Enthusiast
Pronouns
Any
My takes on the proto tracks is simple:
  • Knuckles Theme - they can just use the & Knuckles one anyway.
  • Mini Boss Theme - they can just use the & Knuckles one anyway.
  • Carnival Night - proto is WAY better than the final.
  • Ice Cap - final is WAY better than the proto.
  • Launch Base - I like both actually, no strong preference here.
  • Credits - don't really care; especially since it's irrelevant to 3&K.
  • Competition Results - is anyone really bothered by this one.
  • Super Sonic theme - just please implement the proto one, I beg you.
So what Sega clearly should be doing is paying Brad Buxer for Ice Cap. These are all great though.

 

chocolate_supra

Must proceed at a high velocity #TeamDecade
Pronouns
He/Him
FamiGold
-127
My takes on the proto tracks is simple:
  • Knuckles Theme - they can just use the & Knuckles one anyway.
  • Mini Boss Theme - they can just use the & Knuckles one anyway.
  • Carnival Night - proto is WAY better than the final.
  • Ice Cap - final is WAY better than the proto.
  • Launch Base - I like both actually, no strong preference here.
  • Credits - don't really care; especially since it's irrelevant to 3&K.
  • Competition Results - is anyone really bothered by this one.
  • Super Sonic theme - just please implement the proto one, I beg you.
So what Sega clearly should be doing is paying Brad Buxer for Ice Cap. These are all great though.

The more I listen to the proto tracks, the better I think they mesh with the sound of the game. Especially Launch Base, which had a weirdly mellow vibe for being the "final" zone of that game (at the time). And Carnival Night sounds more in line with the 2-player stages, so it meshes better, as well. So I actually kinda agree with you. Pay Buxer for Hard Times and proto the rest. 🀘
 

Leo

Daffy Duck without the heart
Pronouns
He/Him
So, I don't think anything is technically 100% confirmed, so some of this may be wrong, but afaik it's mostly correct (or at least what is understood to be correct).

The original tracks are what is in the prototype of Sonic 3 that was unearthed a few years ago. Then MJ and his collaborators came in and some music was replaced with their tracks (which includes stuff like Carnival Night, Ice Cap, Launch Base, and the Credits).

I don't think Sega have ever really publicly acknowledged there's a legal issue with these tracks, but that's the general understanding and it seems to be insanely complex. It's believed MJ wasn't happy with the audio hardware of the Mega Drive and pulled out of the project, leaving him uncredited but his tracks still in the game. Most rereleases of Sonic 3/S3&K are basically an emulated ROM of the original MD/Genesis release with the MJ music intact - it's not really clear if Sega had the rights to do this or if they simply weren't challenged on it legally, and it seems at some point they stopped even doing this after the 2011 Steam release.

The PC port from the 90s, on the other hand used MIDI music, dropping the various MJ tracks for the prototype versions (at the time, it wasn't clear if this was new music made especially to replace the MJ music or not, but the prototype Sonic 3 ROM proved that this music was implemented first and then replaced by the MJ music).

So the issue with Sonic Origins is that unless Sega have managed to resolve the legal issues with the MJ music, they will need to seek an alternative, and the most obvious solution is to use the prototype tracks.

That's fascinating. I looked more into, and apparently someone who was involved with the production of the Genesis mini said the game wasn't included because of licensing problems with the music. I have never played Sonic 3, so I'm cool with whatever, but I've listened to the PC midi music and it sounds really bad, of they go with that version I hope they make it sound like the prototype versions.
 
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Robin64

Robin64

Switch Icon Snob
Now on the Aus and NZ PSN stores dated June 22nd!

Classic Sonic Re-Defined

This product entitles you to download both the digital PS4β„’ version and the digital PS5β„’ version of this game.

Relive the classic collected adventures of Sonic The Hedgehog, Sonic The Hedgehog 2, Sonic 3 & Knuckles, and Sonic CD in the newly remastered Sonic Origins! From the iconic Green Hill Zone to the treacherous Death Egg Robot, you'll speed down memory lane to thwart the sinister plans of Doctor Robotnik in polished high definition! This latest version includes new areas to explore, additional animations, and a brand new Anniversary mode!

Classic Re-Defined
Explore the classic Sonic titles in high-resolution, with all-new opening and ending animations for each title!

New Unlockables
Complete various missions to collect coins to unlock new content, challenges, and Special Stages through the Museum.

Classic and Anniversary Mode
Choose to Spin Dash your way through the numerous zones in Classic mode with the game's original resolution and limited lives, or the new Anniversary mode with unlimited lives and revamped fullscreen resolution.

cMPUrcoTKvKYEmdXBOtcVHPi.png
YgQrhKp7vX7lFHqm3HC05VH8.png
JnqTseQrg7gnHYzx0f3kl93Z.jpg
 

Magic-Man

Local Theme Park Nerd
Pronouns
He/Him
This is almost certainly referring to the addition of Hidden Palace Zone in Sonic 2; since these are based off of the Taxman mobile releases.
Wouldn't that just be a single new area though? This alludes to multiple.
 

Dcubed

Bob-omb
Wouldn't that just be a single new area though? This alludes to multiple.

I wouldn't read too much into the nonclamanture here. It's not referring to multiple "zones" but "areas"; "areas" could mean basically anything since that's not a Sonic series term. Now, if they had said "zones", that would've been a different matter...

Occam's Razor dictates that it's most likely just Hidden Palace Zone.
 

MisterSpo

Gerudo
Founder
Pronouns
He/Him
June 22nd! Typical. Just pile all the releases I want into June and July, why the hell not.
 
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Robin64

Robin64

Switch Icon Snob
There it is.



A β€œDigital Deluxe” version with extra perks, including more challenging missions, special character animations, and music tracks from other Genesis titles, will cost $44.99

Pre-order and receive the Start Dash DLC pack featuring in-game currency 100 Bonus Coins, new Mirror Mode unlocked and customize your playthrough with themed Letterbox Background
 

Phoenom

Rattata
Pronouns
He/Him
Maybe they mean 4k With 60fps? Like the Switch version is 1080p with 60 instead. I hope so at least
 

chocolate_supra

Must proceed at a high velocity #TeamDecade
Pronouns
He/Him
FamiGold
-127
Maybe they mean 4k With 60fps? Like the Switch version is 1080p with 60 instead. I hope so at least
Oooh okay, like the combination of 4k and 60fps isn't available on Switch but maybe the framerate will still be good. Okay. I hope so. I normally don't trip about framerates at all but Sonic needs it.

Since the Switch version is listed as "coming soon" on the website I checked out the Xbox version to look into pricing and such and Xbox's website says the game supports raytracing? Which I find hard to believe. So maybe some of the features they list are simply boilerplate after all. πŸ€·β€β™‚οΈ
 

totofogo

irritating LGBT character
Pronouns
he/him πŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆ
Oh wow I was expecting this to be bundled into a Sonic Central and not come out so soon - neat!

Tiers for a retro collection are weird tho agreed lol, luckily Sega is fast + strong with sales usually and launch discounts
 

9-Volt

Tingle
Pronouns
he/him
Jesus, they all look beautiful in full widescreen. Everyone should do the same, I want all of 16-bit classics in widescreen.
 

totofogo

irritating LGBT character
Pronouns
he/him πŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆ
Website is live too!


That menu UI is... a but of a mismash, but as long as the games within are sound I can deal. Mission mode and a "map" are encouraging!

ss3_1920.webp
 
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Serif

Boo
Pronouns
He/Him
These are 2D sidescrollers that run on mobile devices, unless there's some massive fuck up, I see literally no reason to worry if these are 60fps on Switch or not, lmao.
 

totofogo

irritating LGBT character
Pronouns
he/him πŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆ
The digital deluxe is only a $5 bump and a column on that chart is pre-order content fyi
 

chocolate_supra

Must proceed at a high velocity #TeamDecade
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He/Him
FamiGold
-127
Any time a chart like this is needed to explain a game's content, you've failed as a Publisher.

Still really love the look of this and that awesome animation, but day one DLC for a retro games collection is iffy.
hqdefault.jpg

😏😏😏

These are 2D sidescrollers that run on mobile devices, unless there's some massive fuck up, I see literally no reason to worry if these are 60fps on Switch or not, lmao.
Yeah I sure hope so. I probably still just have a little PTSD from the day that they confirmed the remaster of Sonic Colors (a Wii game) would be 30fps on Switch and 60fps on everything else. And one of the actual Sonic social media people went on twitter talking about what a hard time the Switch has running 3rd party games and asked the fans what they'd think if Sega were to do completely different, lo-fi alternate versions of Sonic games for Switch like they used to do back in the DS/Wii era, and it seriously got me wondering if Sega even fucking knows how to optimize for the platform.
 

totofogo

irritating LGBT character
Pronouns
he/him πŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆ
Very nice. Coins seem to replace the lives system in Anniversary mode and are used for unlockables.

Much more effort went into this than I expected from the (early) reveal!
 

Serif

Boo
Pronouns
He/Him
Yeah I sure hope so. I probably still just have a little PTSD from the day that they confirmed the remaster of Sonic Colors (a Wii game) would be 30fps on Switch and 60fps on everything else. And one of the actual Sonic social media people went on twitter talking about what a hard time the Switch has running 3rd party games and asked the fans what they'd think if Sega were to do completely different, lo-fi alternate versions of games for Switch like they used to do back in the DS/Wii era, and it seriously got me wondering if Sega even fucking knows how to optimize for the platform.
Sonic Colors Ultimate uses a new engine and wasn't a straight Wii port.

Sonic Mania running on the Switch right now with perfect performance should put your mind at ease.
 

Ozeiyo

Moblin
Pronouns
He/him
Wait they're offering a digital deluxe edition for remasters of 30 year old sonic games?
 

chocolate_supra

Must proceed at a high velocity #TeamDecade
Pronouns
He/Him
FamiGold
-127
I need a physical edition SEGA.
I'm hoping Nintendolife is right about the boxed release, hoping that that's the reason the Origins website lists Switch as "coming soon" without the option to buy yet, and hoping the physical edition will have all the content instead of having half the neat stuff licked behind DLC. I believe. πŸ’™

Sonic Colors Ultimate uses a new engine and wasn't a straight Wii port.

Sonic Mania running on the Switch right now with perfect performance should put your mind at ease.
Yeah, I gotcha. I brought up Colors because the exact same wording was on the fine print for that game as well and it turned out to be correct in the worst way. So I'm hoping it's just boilerplate in this case or, like @Phoenom suggested, they mean the combination of the two will be unavailable, not each feature.

Sorry yall, I'm actually still really loving everything I see, including those menu backgrounds!!!!!! I'm curious to see what the "music tracks from other Genesis titles" means.. like a jukebox mode for the main game, or just like a separate sound test/player that'll have a bunch of extra tracks? And from other Sonic games or from all sorts of Genesis titles?? This is so neat, I'm so excited. And landing just one week after my birthday. Sega loves me. 😁
 

chocolate_supra

Must proceed at a high velocity #TeamDecade
Pronouns
He/Him
FamiGold
-127
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Robin64

Robin64

Switch Icon Snob
I'm curious to see what the "music tracks from other Genesis titles" means.. like a jukebox mode for the main game, or just like a separate sound test/player that'll have a bunch of extra tracks? And from other Sonic games or from all sorts of Genesis titles??

It means you get Spinball, Chaotix, and 3D Blast music in the sound test.
 
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