Discussion So with basically all first party games now on the table, what we thinking third party on N64 NSO?

[Mandos]

So, considering how much they teased specifically we know basically all first party N64 games are on the table. Most of Rare is too. But that’s not what we’re here to talk about. That tease was just “yes we’re bringing the big hitters and keeping updates more normal again.” Now as no other third parties were shown we don’t have a clue what’ll be coming, but that wasn’t the release schedule either. So it’s likely like the other systems where third parties aren’t shown till release(Genesis didn’t get a road map and it has more coming). Now no need to quibble over the update schedule, we’ll get a hint with the info later this month.

So for launch we got Koei Tecmo with their only N64 title, Winback. It shows we have Japanese support but not the scope, it also means controller memory pack reliant games are on the table. But in the same measure we have the Genesis lineup. Along with confirming continued Sega/Atlus support( which with super famicom getting SMT) basically assures we’ll get Snowboard Kids 1/2, but they don’t have much beyond that. Konami is back as well with Genesis games that have also been in their paid collections. So the Konami Hudsonsoft lineup should be on the table.

So now that begs the question what’s beyond that? And that’s where the discussion comes in. Figuring out which other partners who’ve previously supported NSO are on the table for this one(like Natsume bringing Flying dragon perhaps). Not to mention the random rights holders. So thoughts?

 

[Gartooth]

I want to see Rush 2 Extreme Racing USA show up. Love good arcade racers and it would be a nice contrast to the kart racers. I used to play that stunt race track all the time on N64.

 

[9-Volt]

Many of the "golden four" published games had their licenses lost, I don't expect any of them to come back. Nightdive did acquire Turok games but that's it. Nobody knows who has San Francisco Rush license, I doubt WB still has them.

We'll most likely get all Natsume games on N64, which is basically Harvest Moon and Flying Dragon. I'm not sure about the rest. We already got the only Koei game on the system and Natsume and Koei Tecmo have been the biggest supporters of any VC system.

 

[MisterSpo]

I'd like to see Mystical Ninja, Mischief Makers, and Space Station Silicon Valley. Absolutely zero idea how likely these are, though.

 

[Mandos]

I'd like to see Mystical Ninja, Mischief Makers, and Space Station Silicon Valley. Absolutely zero idea how likely these are, though.

Treasure teased more games coming. As for the Goemon series that’s under Konami and they seem to be supporting NSO again looking at the Genesis launch and their N64 catalog is a lot of work for little return for a collection release so I’d say that their N64 games(and Hudsonsoft’s) are good odds

I think Take2 has Space Station Silicon Valley, want to say it and Body Harvest were made by rockstar before they were rockstar

Many of the "golden four" published games had their licenses lost, I don't expect any of them to come back. Nightdive did acquire Turok games but that's it. Nobody knows who has San Francisco Rush license, I doubt WB still has them.

We'll most likely get all Natsume games on N64, which is basically Harvest Moon and Flying Dragon. I'm not sure about the rest. We already got the only Koei game on the system and Natsume and Koei Tecmo have been the biggest supporters of any VC system.

I do wonder if KT acquired any of the independent devs from that era, there were a number of Japan only games from some pretty random groups

 

[Mr_No_U]

Gimme Hybrid Heaven plz

 

[MondoMega]

Treasure have already officially teased that more of their games will be coming to NSO, so i'm safely putting Mischief Makers (co-owned by Square Enix) and Bangai-O (100% owned by them) on the Probably Happening pile.




As for other third-party publishers, well, I feel it'd be best to look back to what was available on or planned to be available on Virtual Console for Wii and Wii U. I posted an incomplete version of the list on Era, but this one should be a lot more accurate.

Konami, Square Enix and Marvelous / Natsume were the only third-party publishers to release games on N64 VC in the past, but there were clearly more titles in the works from other publishers and even more games from those former two publishers. As for what would be likely to make it onto NSO now, obviously Konami are up there with Bomberman, Goemon, Castlevania and Hybrid Heaven. Don't think Spike Chunsoft would be against Shiren 2 happening; but i'm less sold on Resident Evil 2 and Lode Runner.

Going to go out on a limb and say Tony Hawk, Turok and Quake aren't happening on NSO; those have remasters available on the Switch and other platforms already. It's fun that A Bug's Life of all things was considered for Wii, but that's obviously not going to happen now.

Side-note, but as you can see I have no clue who owns the licence for Robotron now. It's easy enough to figure out where Turok and Iggy's Reckin' Balls ended up, but not this one.

 

[Starphanluke]

I genuinely think most Rare games are on the table, aside from Goldeneye.

Lucasfilm also seems willing to work with the console publishers, so I wouldn't rule out a couple of Star Wars games, too.

 

[Dinoman96]

Huh, Rare's N64 library was also tested for the Wii VC (besides Tooie going by that list)?

 

[Mandos]

Treasure have already officially teased that more of their games will be coming to NSO, so i'm safely putting Mischief Makers (co-owned by Square Enix) and Bangai-O (100% owned by them) on the Probably Happening pile.




As for other third-party publishers, well, I feel it'd be best to look back to what was available on or planned to be available on Virtual Console for Wii and Wii U. I posted an incomplete version of the list on Era, but this one should be a lot more accurate.

Konami, Square Enix and Marvelous / Natsume were the only third-party publishers to release games on N64 VC in the past, but there were clearly more titles in the works from other publishers and even more games from those former two publishers. As for what would be likely to make it onto NSO now, obviously Konami are up there with Bomberman, Goemon, Castlevania and Hybrid Heaven. Don't think Spike Chunsoft would be against Shiren 2 happening; but i'm less sold on Resident Evil 2 and Lode Runner.

Going to go out on a limb and say Tony Hawk, Turok and Quake aren't happening on NSO; those have remasters available on the Switch and other platforms already. It's fun that A Bug's Life of all things was considered for Wii, but that's obviously not going to happen now.

Side-note, but as you can see I have no clue who owns the licence for Robotron now. It's easy enough to figure out where Turok and Iggy's Reckin' Balls ended up, but not this one.

Was looking forward to you posting this. I know there’s some doubt on Konami after some Snes datamined stuff hasn’t happened (yet), but I really think the Genesis lineup shows they’ll be back for 64. And yeah the Vc 12 will definitely happen. I know Ogre Battle is a ? Mark but it did come back later on for N64

 

[Mr_No_U]

Man, I love Treasure.

 

[FormatCompatible]

I'm not sure who owns the Chameleon Twist ip after Japan System Supply went under. It could be Sunsoft since they were the publisher outside of Japan and if that's the case then it would be one I could see be included since Sunsoft has been including their stuff on NSO.

Whoever owns it now I hope they bring them to the NSO.

 

[9-Volt]

Treasure have already officially teased that more of their games will be coming to NSO, so i'm safely putting Mischief Makers (co-owned by Square Enix) and Bangai-O (100% owned by them) on the Probably Happening pile.

Square doesn't seem to be interested in NSO right now, they rather re-release their games in overpriced compilations. Still, Mischief Makers is just a one game, maybe they'll let this one go for one time. I'm not hopeful though.

 

[MondoMega]

Huh, Rare's N64 library was also tested for the Wii VC (besides Tooie going by that list)?

Yes, that does appear to be the case. I'll add that a lot of them were added over time too; comparing the earliest iteration of the emulator (batched in with Super Mario 64) to a later release, only Blast Corps and Donkey Kong 64 were there from the start.

Square doesn't seem to be interested in NSO right now, they rather re-release their games in overpriced compilations. Still, Mischief Makers is just a one game, maybe they'll let this one go for one time. I'm not hopeful though.

I'd like to think the Expansion Pack model may draw in third-parties like Square Enix that avoided the vanilla subscription. Konami and Capcom already have games confirmed for Mega Drive; games that were already available in paid compilations in Konami's case; it's hopefully a sign that things are different now. Time will tell though.

 

[Deleted member 22]

I could see stuff like Castlevania, Mortal Kombat 4/Trilogy, Rayman 2, Ridge Racer 64... games that have clear owners. Maybe International Superstar Soccer 64? It's a good thing it didn't have real names in it. Not sure about Doom 64 or Star Wars Episode 1 Racer cause they rereleased those somewhat recently.

 

[Mandos]

I will say, Japan is definitely the side more likely to see some fun surprises. Like fire electric pen, the Sumo duology, Shiren 2 for some examples. Especially since they confirmed custom Robo V1/2 out the gate for Japan having more exclusives

 

[Josh5890]

Yes, that does appear to be the case. I'll add that a lot of them were added over time too; comparing the earliest iteration of the emulator (batched in with Super Mario 64) to a later release, only Blast Corps and Donkey Kong 64 were there from the start.


I'd like to think the Expansion Pack model may draw in third-parties like Square Enix that avoided the vanilla subscription. Konami and Capcom already have games confirmed for Mega Drive; games that were already available in paid compilations in Konami's case; it's hopefully a sign that things are different now. Time will tell though.

The problem with Square though is that they don't have any N64 games. I can't see Nintendo agreeing to put Square games on the SNES app as an expansion pass add on only. That would be confusing for the average consumer and turn into a mess IMO.

 

[Mandos]

The problem with Square though is that they don't have any N64 games. I can't see Nintendo agreeing to put Square games on the SNES app as an expansion pass add on only. That would be confusing for the average consumer and turn into a mess IMO.

They do, one,

That’s what the argument is over. Tho it was on VC so it coming back isn’t out of the range of possibility

 

[Josh5890]

They do, one,

That’s what the argument is over. Tho it was on VC so it coming back isn’t out of the range of possibility

Oh crap. I forgot that they own that IP.

 

[CyberWolfBia]

the usual suspects from previous VC we'll see returning, for sure (Ogre Battle 64, Bomberman 64 n Bomberman Hero); Rare of course is chock full of options and Konami should probably wide up their catalog with Goemon, Castlevania and so forth.

Winback being the first one popping up was a surprise tho; I expect most Japanese companies will jump on board, and in general I can't see anything M-Rated like Resident Evil 2, Perfect Dark or Duke Nukem 64 (T-Rated games at max).

No licensed games either, of course (that applies to GoldenEye, by the way); that goes without saying

 

[MondoMega]

The problem with Square though is that they don't have any N64 games.

Ogre Battle and Mischief Makers, as discussed.

I honestly don't think NES, SNES and eventually GB games only available with the Expansion Pass is an impossibility, though it'd need to be rare exceptions where their exclusivity can be justified to general consumers. I think Pokemon is the most likely candidate for that treatment; you make GB avaialble on the regular sub but because Pokemon is Pokemon thoose games are only unlocked with the premium tier sub. They charged more than usual for them on 3DS VC after all; same for Earthbound Beginnings, Earthbound and SE's Super Famicom games in Japan too actually.

the usual suspects from previous VC we'll see returning, for sure (Ogre Battle 64, Bomberman 64 n Bomberman Hero); Rare of course is chock full of options and Konami should probably wide up their catalog with Goemon, Castlevania and so forth.

Winback being the first one popping up was a surprise tho; I expect most Japanese companies will jump on board, and in general I can't see anything M-Rated like Resident Evil 2, Perfect Dark or Duke Nukem 64 (T-Rated games at max).

No licensed games either, of course (that applies to GoldenEye, by the way); that goes without saying

I feel like concerns over age ratings could be solved by incorporating parental control features into the app. Hide or lock access to games that exceed whatever rating you set it to.

 

[Mr_No_U]

They do, one,

That’s what the argument is over. Tho it was on VC so it coming back isn’t out of the range of possibility

That's a good one!

 

[k samedi]

I enjoyed Body Harvest and Turok 2 a lot. The datamined list would make me very happy though. Stuff like Resident Evil 2 and Star Craft 64 would be awesome. And not to forget, all the Rare games on N64 were amazing with Goldeneye being the best game on the system by far. Getting Rare games on the system is worth the extra price for me.

 

[Dinoman96]

Here's a venn diagram of all N64 games that have been announced/released for the previous Virtual Consoles + NSO

 

[ActWan]

I know there's no chance, but I really love Fighter's Destiny. If it ever makes it, you can bet on me never letting go of the sub.

 

[Mandos]

I know there's no chance, but I really love Fighter's Destiny. If it ever makes it, you can bet on me never letting go of the sub.

Odds are decent actually, Opus Corp, the devs are still a middleware company in Japan, one of the major games they provided support was kid Icarus uprising interestingly enough

 

[ActWan]

Odds are decent actually, Opus Corp, the devs are still a middleware company in Japan, one of the major games they provided support was kid Icarus uprising interestingly enough

Oh damn, I had no idea! Let's hope then

 

[Scrawnton]

Here's a venn diagram of all N64 games that have been announced/released for the previous Virtual Consoles + NSO

Probably gonna be my next tattoo, honestly.


On a more serious note; I’d love for the South Park game to make an appearance.

 

[Mandos]

Oh damn, I had no idea! Let's hope then

I didn’t know either, I looked it up XD. But yeah most Japanese third party games are on the table I’d say, a lot are still around as middleware or got merged

 

[javac]

You think Microsoft lends perfect dark or something like that.

 

[Deleted User 1]

Give me TUROK 2.

 

[Weebos]

GoldenEye is significant enough that they might try to secure it, but it will be a challenge.

 

[Oolong]

I would love to see Beetle Adventure Racing, but no way that would ever happen.

I wonder if WB would put the Rampage games on the service.

 

[Mandos]

@ActWan it was also published by imagineer in Japan, who you might know for boxing fitness on switch or medabots

Edit they also did big mountain 2000, Quest 64, and some Japan only titles

 

[Red Monster]

I want to see Rush 2 Extreme Racing USA show up. Love good arcade racers and it would be a nice contrast to the kart racers. I used to play that stunt race track all the time on N64.

First post absolutely nails it. Rush 2 is amazing. Too bad it probably won’t make it to NSO

 

[Deleted member 22]

Here's an archive of gamerankings.com scores. It has many more N64 games compared to metacritic.

https://gr.blade.sk/#/

 

[Mandos]

Here's an archive of gamerankings.com scores. It has many more N64 games compared to metacritic.

https://gr.blade.sk/#/

Winback is higher rated than Kirby and MP3 XD. Then again a number of things lower than they should be and that’s even with the scale being used properly

 

[nenned]

I'm thinking Castlevania, Goemon, Hybrid Heaven, and Bomberman from Konami, Ogre Battle and Mischief Makers from Square-Enix, Mega Man 64 and Resident Evil 2 from Capcom, Banjo-Kazooie & Tooie, Perfect Dark, Killer Instinct Gold, Jet Force Gemini, and Blast Corps from Microsoft/Rare, Harvest Moon from Natsume, and Turok 1 & 2.

 

[Krvavi Abadas]

Glover and Starshot: Space Circus Fever are almost certainly going to be added eventually, considering Piko Interactive was actively supporting the NES application.

Possibly 40 Winks as well, depending on if Nintendo is willing to allow a 3rd party previously unreleased game on the service.

Huh, Rare's N64 library was also tested for the Wii VC (besides Tooie going by that list)?

Yeah, i don't think them testing it would be 100% proof that everything listed was going to be added. But two N64 Rare games appeared in an internal document about the Virtual Console Launch plans.

(Yes, they really were considering Goldeneye.)

Blast Corps seems to be a weird case in that Nintendo was especially insistent they still had some form of rights to it. Considering it was also (alongside Jet Force Gemini) supposed to get represented in Smash Bros Ultimate, and it was one of the two N64 games (Alongside Banjo-Kazooie, which is already confirmed to be part of the initial Switch lineup.) that was mistakenly listed on Nintendo's Japanese release calendar.

In case you were wondering if Rare games were also listed on the other platforms, that was indeed the case. Battletoads (Which was published by Masaya in Japan, who's current owners still seem to have some ownership of the IP. Considering it showed up in the "PicoPico" iOS game subscription service.) and RC Pro Arm were listed for the NES, and Killer Instinct was listed for the SNES.

 

[MondoMega]

Yeah, i don't think them testing it would be 100% proof that everything listed was going to be added. But two N64 Rare games appeared in an internal document about the Virtual Console Launch plans.

(Yes, they really were considering Goldeneye.)

Blast Corps seems to be a weird case in that Nintendo was especially insistent they still had some form of rights to it. Considering it was also (alongside Jet Force Gemini) supposed to get represented in Smash Bros Ultimate, and it was one of the two N64 games (Alongside Banjo-Kazooie, which is already confirmed to be part of the initial Switch lineup.) that was mistakenly listed on Nintendo's Japanese release calendar.

In case you were wondering if Rare games were also listed on the other platforms, that was indeed the case. Battletoads (Which was published by Masaya in Japan, who's current owners still seem to have some ownership of the IP. Considering it showed up in the "PicoPico" iOS game subscription service.) and RC Pro Arm were listed for the NES, and Killer Instinct was listed for the SNES.

Do you happen to have the full spreadsheet this is from? I'm asuming it was part of a Gigaleak batch, but i've never seen this before. Seeing Shiren 2 listed there makes me curious since there was no internal reference to it in the Wii VC emulator, only on Wii U.

but yes, Nintendo and Microsoft were in the process of figuring something out with Goldeneye twice, in 2007 (for Wii VC and the XBLA remaster) and 2015 (for Wii U VC and Rare Replay). Third times the charm, perhaps?

 

[Dinoman96]

It's also worth noting that during the Goldeneye remake fiasco, it was stated that Rare had actually offered Nintendo to bring their entire N64 back catalogue to Wii's VC.

So perhaps that explains it.

 

[Lovecatt]

I need snowboard kids

 

[Dopply]

I'd say Mischief Makers is basically a lock-in. Beyond that, I just hope we get more Rare games.

 

[Mandos]

I need snowboard kids

Snes got SMT and we got a full sega console so I’d say odds are good

 

[Der Bubsen]

Gearbox supports the switch, so i hope they also support NSO and put Duke Nukem Zero Hour on the Service.

 

[Mr_No_U]

with all the money Nintendo is leaving on the table, is there even room for games?

 

[Ostia]

They really need to get Konami on board so we can get Konami and Hudson titles on the service. Maybe we don’t see the two Castlevania games (they probably want to do a 3D collection somewhere down the line) but Goemon and Bomberman should be possible.

 

[Krvavi Abadas]

Do you happen to have the full spreadsheet this is from? I'm asuming it was part of a Gigaleak batch, but i've never seen this before. Seeing Shiren 2 listed there makes me curious since there was no internal reference to it in the Wii VC emulator, only on Wii U.

Correct, it's from the gigaleak (The e-mails to be specific). The exact filename should be "RVL-VC-JP+US_051222_rev.xls". Not 100% sure if i'm allowed to post the whole thing, but it shouldn't be too hard to find.

It might also be mentioned in "Launch_Title060816.xls" or "バグリスト【ＶＣソフトチェック】_20061215.xls" too, but it's been a while since i checked.

 

[wrowa]

I think most companies aren't fixated on delivering their games through a single channel and would potentially be interested if Nintendo made a good offer, even if these companies also publish their games through collections. An extreme example for this would be Sega, some of whose games will be available four separate times on the Switch in the near future (Sega Ages, Mega Drive Classics, Mega Drive on NSO, Sonic Origin Collection). It's clear, however, that Nintendo's NSO budget only amounted to pennies in the past, which limited their 3rd party gets to only the obscurest of titles. It's gonna be interesting to see if they increased their 3rd party budget for the premium subscription to make more interesting titles happen. Starting the service with Winback, which is an interesting pick but also one people wouldn't really have asked for, is not all that promising in that regard. They definitely shelled out some good money to make Banjo Kazooie happen though, will also be interesting to see if they're willing to spend more money on Rare's library.

 

[Burning Justice]

I need snowboard kids

This please!