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StarTopic Marvel Cinematic Universe |ST| The Eternal Universe

Sadist

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Question for anyone that is more into the comics:

MCU started with an almost realistic Iron Man fighting terrorist movie, moved on to Captain America fighting Multi-National evil organizations, with universe threating Thanos always in the background as the big threat.

Loki / Dr.Strange 2 over-arching theme spoilers, no actual plot details:
Now the big threat in phase 4 is to the entire multi-verse,
The power Inflation is so high that, where does Marvel go from Phase 4? What could they possibly do that could be a bigger threat than multi-verse destroying? I`m sure the comics has suffered with the same problem.
doom-pull-strings.jpg
 

chocolate_supra

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THIS.

Following the Infinity Saga with the 3 Avengers foes beginning with an already-established villain of one of the team members (Loki) setting into motion connections which would lead to a galactic threat (Thanos), I figured the introduction of the Fantastic 4 would allow for a similar structure: where the first Avengers-level baddie is an already-established villain of one of the team (Dr Doom) setting into motion connections which would lead to a galactic threat (Galactus).

I figured they were heading towards Galactus with the MCU going more cosmic (Eternals, Nick Fury being in space, etc), but with them now seeming to go whole-hog into the multiverse with Loki, Spidey, and Dr Strange (and potentially Thor Four: More Thor) I assume they're leading towards the next big bad being more about that, as Loki already set up Immortus and Kang, who is confirmed to appear in Quantumania, so now who the eff knows.

But to whittle it down to an answer to @Koyota's question: I firmly believe that the Fantastic 4 being introduced into the MCU means one of the new Avengers movies will be about Galactus.

And that will be some power inflation for ya.
 

Sadist

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You have Galactus, Kang, multiversal threats… hell they could even think about the Beyonders. The latter is absolutely terrifying

The Russo’s also mentioned that if they would be asked to come back when Secret Wars comes into play they will definitely do it; it makes me wonder if somewhere Kevin Feige has a roadmap planned towards Secret Wars; its also a story that doesn’t need a Cap or Iron Man, with the surviving heroes being Mr. Fantastic, Panther, Spider-Man, Star Lord, Captain Marvel, Jane Thor and a Phoenix powered Cyclops.

Would be a cool line up to face off with a godlike Doom.
 

Brock Reiher

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doctor doom as all powerful is hard to take seriously. I liked him the best as a smarmy businessman with magnet powers.
 

Clov

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doctor doom as all powerful is hard to take seriously. I liked him the best as a smarmy businessman with magnet powers.

Have to agree with this. I think Dr. Doom is a bit too goofy to be the next Thanos of the MCU. That's why I'd recommend Magneto instead; you still get the magnet powers, but someone who's a threat not just to superheroes, but ordinary citizens too.


Doom would never stoop this low, but Magneto evidently isn't afraid to use his powers to the detriment of all those around him. A true menace to society.
 

MondoMega

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Then you know why Magneto and Doom will be the toughest villains this universe has ever seen. Thanos is only D or C Tier compared to these A and S Tier threats.
 

Phosphorescent Skeleton

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Question for anyone that is more into the comics:

MCU started with an almost realistic Iron Man fighting terrorist movie, moved on to Captain America fighting Multi-National evil organizations, with universe threating Thanos always in the background as the big threat.

Loki / Dr.Strange 2 over-arching theme spoilers, no actual plot details:
Now the big threat in phase 4 is to the entire multi-verse,
The power Inflation is so high that, where does Marvel go from Phase 4? What could they possibly do that could be a bigger threat than multi-verse destroying? I`m sure the comics has suffered with the same problem.
The problem is all the movies are done like event comics, which are definitely a shell game of diminishing returns. Always escalating stakes is a recipe for disappointment in a story that can never actually end. Super hero comics are usually better for me when they're focused on one hero and have smaller stakes. Doctor Doom rules, but he rules because he's a petty asshole, not as a multidimensional threat.
This would make a better movie than anything in the MCU:
images
 

Dardan Sandiego

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The problem is all the movies are done like event comics, which are definitely a shell game of diminishing returns. Always escalating stakes is a recipe for disappointment in a story that can never actually end. Super hero comics are usually better for me when they're focused on one hero and have smaller stakes. Doctor Doom rules, but he rules because he's a petty asshole, not as a multidimensional threat.
This would make a better movie than anything in the MCU:
images
That's cheating, though. Pick any older Doom panel(s) and you got a great movie template

sKhoWF89nlMC-PXfyyXlvJ-P-G3CXNbKNfsdoU1UNt8.jpg
 

Clov

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The problem is all the movies are done like event comics, which are definitely a shell game of diminishing returns. Always escalating stakes is a recipe for disappointment in a story that can never actually end. Super hero comics are usually better for me when they're focused on one hero and have smaller stakes. Doctor Doom rules, but he rules because he's a petty asshole, not as a multidimensional threat.
This would make a better movie than anything in the MCU:
images

Yet another reason why Venom 2 ruled so much; very simplistic story! There's a mean symbiote who's about to Let There Be Carnage, and it's up to Venom to stop him. While it falls into some of the typical MCU trappings, great moments like Glowstick Venom and Woody Harrelson's voiceovers cement it as an excellent 3/5 star film.

More on topic, that panel rules and would make for an incredible film. Personally I've always been waiting to see this classic Marvel showdown hit the big screen:

75acbc0fc587e8c60decf9e4901acf91-800.jpg


draculatag.png
 
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Brock Reiher

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Venom 2 was indeed great. I think Doctor Doom only has one possible storyline in the MCU: the Doctor Doom from the old movie comes to the MCU and gets mad that Tony Stark is a more famous metal-headed rich guy who has put his name on more buildings than Doom did. He then pretends to be a good guy out of spite and then, scorpion that he is, eventually does something bad like stealing candy from a baby. And when he does the Thing shows up and says "it's clobbering time" and punches him into fine metal dust. Fin
 

Fercho

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Venom 2 was indeed great.

I respectfully disagree :S i just watched it on HBO MAX and i thought it was a terrible movie, i really liked the first one and had great fun, but think this one was a mess and nowhere close on how imagined Carnage to be portrayed in the big screen, very disappointed.

So, there is no chance for this Venom continuity to be related to other universes, right? (Other than the symbiote being already included in the future of MCU) , so basically this was the last movie from Hardy?
 

Sadist

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Eh it depends how the events are done. Especially reading a few comments here that they like how Doom is cool because he is petty, that’s the reason why I want Doom as a multiversal threat.

I mean in Hickman’s Avengers run culminating in Secret Wars ‘15 Doom was a god and he did several petty things

- After Strange did a Jon Snow move “I don’t wan’ it” and Doom created a patch work planet and he made sure there wasn’t one speck left that Reed Richards ever existed

- He made Sue his wife, with Franklin and Valeria being his kids

- He turned Johnny into the sun (lol)

- Ben got turned in a GoT like wall called the Shield which kept out the Marvel Zombies, the Annihilation wave and the Ultron A.I.

- When Reed (616) does appear, Sue is like “I don’t know why but this man seems familiar” and Doom heads out to find him right away.

Also, Doom snapping a Phoenix powered Cyclops neck like it’s nothing and ripping out Thanos’s spine are still one the high points ha

In other words universal threat Doom? Awwww yissss
 

Dardan Sandiego

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Yet another reason why Venom 2 ruled so much
Venom 2 was indeed great.

Not sure how you can say this when Venom 2 doesn't even deliver on the high expectations set up by the previous one (which is a pretty misunderstood movie in its own right) and fails to commit to Venom's most defining characteristics, in turn dropping the ball across the board. The problem is really that they gave the character to someone who didn't understand what Hardy and Fleischer were going for in the original, making Let there be Carnage feel very disjointed from Venom 1. But I love Andy Serkis and his work and I think he did a pretty good job with Venom 2, a big improvement over the 2018 film and I can't wait to see what they do with the character next.
 

Illucio

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Question for anyone that is more into the comics:

MCU started with an almost realistic Iron Man fighting terrorist movie, moved on to Captain America fighting Multi-National evil organizations, with universe threating Thanos always in the background as the big threat.

Loki / Dr.Strange 2 over-arching theme spoilers, no actual plot details:
Now the big threat in phase 4 is to the entire multi-verse,
The power Inflation is so high that, where does Marvel go from Phase 4? What could they possibly do that could be a bigger threat than multi-verse destroying? I`m sure the comics has suffered with the same problem.
Galactus, Knull, Sentinels, Doom, Mephisto, Phoenix Force, The Beyonder, Apocalypse, Magus, Kree, Super Skrulls.

Heroes from different universes now part of MCU after incursion event like Miles Morales, Spider-Gwen, Captain Carter, Wonder Man, Man-Thing, Hyperion and so on.

Justice League Vs. Avengers

Stories set in alternate universes like in What If

The list really does go on...
 

Clov

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I respectfully disagree :S i just watched it on HBO MAX and i thought it was a terrible movie, i really liked the first one and had great fun, but think this one was a mess and nowhere close on how imagined Carnage to be portrayed in the big screen, very disappointed.

So, there is no chance for this Venom continuity to be related to other universes, right? (Other than the symbiote being already included in the future of MCU) , so basically this was the last movie from Hardy?

I gotta disagree with you there; the original Venom was a fine 2/5 star movie, but Venom 2 really brought it up a star for several reasons. For one, we get Venom right from the get-go, no need to wait like in the first one. Second, the movie is pretty short, and shorter movies are almost always better than longer movies. It took up less of my time and gave me stuff like Venom and his chickens, and Venom and his motorbike, which are both wonderful. Carnage has some great moments too, with Woody Harrelson delivering voiceover lines like "Who said romance is dead?" which practically sent my soul out of my body. It is true that Carnage doesn't live up to his full potential, mainly because the filmmakers were too scared to include Pope Carnage like in the concept art:

FOuHL83XEAofeLa.jpg


This would have bumped it up by half a star.

In any case, this thankfully isn't the last we'll be seeing of Hardy's Venom. Sony has already confirmed Venom 3 is in production! And going from the spoilers I've heard from Morbius...

There's a post credits scene where MCU Vulture recruits Morbius to be a part of a team hunting Spiderman. Between this, Venom 3, and the solo Kraven movie, it's very likely that the Sinister Six is happening, and Venom will be part of it! I can't wait to see Hardy hunting MCU's Spiderman on the big screen!
 

Brock Reiher

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Not sure how you can say this when Venom 2 doesn't even deliver on the high expectations set up by the previous one (which is a pretty misunderstood movie in its own right) and fails to commit to Venom's most defining characteristics, in turn dropping the ball across the board. The problem is really that they gave the character to someone who didn't understand what Hardy and Fleischer were going for in the original, making Let there be Carnage feel very disjointed from Venom 1. But I love Andy Serkis and his work and I think he did a pretty good job with Venom 2, a big improvement over the 2018 film and I can't wait to see what they do with the character next.
I did not see venom 1 I heard it wasn't as good as 2
 

Sadist

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I'd pay lots of Marvel bux to see these guys as a multiversal threat

3738075-society.jpg


With Namor being a giantic douche againts them... because its just so Namor
 

Phosphorescent Skeleton

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I gotta disagree with you there; the original Venom was a fine 2/5 star movie, but Venom 2 really brought it up a star for several reasons. For one, we get Venom right from the get-go, no need to wait like in the first one. Second, the movie is pretty short, and shorter movies are almost always better than longer movies. It took up less of my time and gave me stuff like Venom and his chickens, and Venom and his motorbike, which are both wonderful. Carnage has some great moments too, with Woody Harrelson delivering voiceover lines like "Who said romance is dead?" which practically sent my soul out of my body. It is true that Carnage doesn't live up to his full potential, mainly because the filmmakers were too scared to include Pope Carnage like in the concept art:

FOuHL83XEAofeLa.jpg


This would have bumped it up by half a star.

In any case, this thankfully isn't the last we'll be seeing of Hardy's Venom. Sony has already confirmed Venom 3 is in production! And going from the spoilers I've heard from Morbius...

There's a post credits scene where MCU Vulture recruits Morbius to be a part of a team hunting Spiderman. Between this, Venom 3, and the solo Kraven movie, it's very likely that the Sinister Six is happening, and Venom will be part of it! I can't wait to see Hardy hunting MCU's Spiderman on the big screen!
Venom 2 is good because it doesn't commit the cardinal sin of trying to make a good Venom movie. Wheeeee!
 

Dragoncaine

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I really hope everyone in this thread enjoyed Multiverse of Madness more than I did. Bottom-tier MCU script for me.
 

Romancedawn

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I've not seen the Multiverse of Madness but this morning on the Kelly Klarkson show the actors were interviewed. They got into a topic of life changing teachers and such and Xotchle(America Chavez) said all these wonderful things about her Wushu teacher. I'm her teacher. 😭😭😭 I didn't know about it. A friend text me with a video clip early this morning and was like "is she talking about you?"

 
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chocolate_supra

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I've not seen the Multiverse of Madness but this morning on the Kelly Klarkson show the actors were interviewed. They got into a topic of life changing teachers and such and Xotchle(America Chavez) said all these wonderful things about her Wushu teacher. I'm her teacher. 😭😭😭 I didn't know about it. A friend text me with a video clip early this morning and was like "is she talking about you?"

I very heavily associate users with their avatars, so I'm now having a hard time shaking the picture of Xochitl Gomez being trained in martial arts by Cranky Kong.
(also that's incredibly awesome and touching)
 

Dardan Sandiego

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Both Venom 1 and Venom 2 sadly fail to commit to Venom's most defining character trait: Sitting in a truck and honking the horn. Until we get that I cannot fully call Venom a great movie but if the third one delivers (and there has been a lot of stuff setting up this seminal character moment) it would solidify it as the GOAT comic book movie trilogy.
 

Clov

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Both Venom 1 and Venom 2 sadly fail to commit to Venom's most defining character trait: Sitting in a truck and honking the horn. Until we get that I cannot fully call Venom a great movie but if the third one delivers (and there has been a lot of stuff setting up this seminal character moment) it would solidify it as the GOAT comic book movie trilogy.

They're building up to it! Venom trashing Eddie's bike was just the beginning. That kind of vehicle is just too small and meagre for the likes of Venom. It's very likely that Venom 3 is going to end up as an American adaptation of one of the Truck Yaro films. Plenty of opportunity to honk then!

ClumsyEuphoricAfricanaugurbuzzard-size_restricted.gif


I just hope they still find the time to adapt this recent Venom moment onto the screen:

trade_crop_1024x1024.png
 

Sadist

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Still need to watch the second Venom, but I just didn’t care much for the original movie. Making Venom some loser symbiote just irked me.
 

Clov

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Still need to watch the second Venom, but I just didn’t care much for the original movie. Making Venom some loser symbiote just irked me.

I thought that was one of the best parts! It helps give him chemistry with Eddie. Since the films are making Venom into a distinct, verbal character, they have to give him some sort of trait that helps him connect with Eddie. Eddie has always been a huge loser, so it's perfect that Venom himself is also a big loser. Eddie and Venom's cooperation has always been the key to their success, so being fully united in loserdom is a great step forward for them as characters.
 

Phosphorescent Skeleton

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They're building up to it! Venom trashing Eddie's bike was just the beginning. That kind of vehicle is just too small and meagre for the likes of Venom. It's very likely that Venom 3 is going to end up as an American adaptation of one of the Truck Yaro films. Plenty of opportunity to honk then!

ClumsyEuphoricAfricanaugurbuzzard-size_restricted.gif


I just hope they still find the time to adapt this recent Venom moment onto the screen:

trade_crop_1024x1024.png
Already know who's gonna play the Jonathan the Seagull character in the Venom 3 Truck Yaro film
images

It'll be nice to see Willem Dafoe reprise his career defining performance in a good movie.
 

Dardan Sandiego

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Based on the teaser for Marvel's Spider-Man 2 I'm afraid that Insomniac just completely missed the point of Venom.

They can only rectify it by making a Superior Foes spinoff.
 

chocolate_supra

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Welp

Dr Strange gave me a lot that I wanted to see in a Marvel movie. In hindsight I can see where the script complaints are coming from, but good lord it's like each scene is a setpiece so I didn't even worry about the story, I just buckled in for the ride. The decision to bring Raimi in on what became the closest thing to a full-on MCU horror film was a good choice.
 

Phosphorescent Skeleton

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Welp

Dr Strange gave me a lot that I wanted to see in a Marvel movie. In hindsight I can see where the script complaints are coming from, but good lord it's like each scene is a setpiece so I didn't even worry about the story, I just buckled in for the ride. The decision to bring Raimi in on what became the closest thing to a full-on MCU horror film was a good choice.
A marvel horror movie, huh? I think we all know what they're building up to for phase 5....
images
 

chocolate_supra

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A marvel horror movie, huh? I think we all know what they're building up to for phase 5....
images
Fuck yeah, bring on Mahershala's Blade!

I wish this were true, but I don't see Disney allowing something this gay into the MCU. Pride flag background too powerful
You might be happy to know America Chavez had a pride flag pin on her jacket for the entirety of Multiverse of Madness, and had two moms, very visibly and up-front, not like the barely-there kiss in the background of Rise of Skywalker. Disney woke the eff up a little.
(I hope that's not considewd a spoiler but I didn't wanna play it safe and hide it behind a tag because I believe that deserves to not be hidden.)
 

Clov

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Fuck yeah, bring on Mahershala's Blade!


You might be happy to know America Chavez had a pride flag pin on her jacket for the entirety of Multiverse of Madness, and had two moms, very visibly and up-front, not like the barely-there kiss in the background of Rise of Skywalker. Disney woke the eff up a little.
(I hope that's not considewd a spoiler but I didn't wanna play it safe and hide it behind a tag because I believe that deserves to not be hidden.)

Baby steps, I guess! It's definitely an improvement over actively cutting out queer content like in Thor Ragnarok, or making their "first gay superhero" a war criminal in Eternals. I'd love to see an unashamedly gay hero as the star, or a trans hero played by a transgender actress/actor, but I don't think it's something Disney is interested in doing.
 

chocolate_supra

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Baby steps, I guess! It's definitely an improvement over actively cutting out queer content like in Thor Ragnarok, or making their "first gay superhero" a war criminal in Eternals. I'd love to see an unashamedly gay hero as the star, or a trans hero played by a transgender actress/actor, but I don't think it's something Disney is interested in doing.
Baby steps indeed. Every little one helps, I hope.
Also, we'll see if it becomes a thing but Tessa Thompson said something during the reveal of Love and Thunder about how now that Valkyrie has taken over for Thor as "king" of Asgard, she will be looking to "find her queen." And that kinda makes me wonder if they had the guts to let Taika pair her with Jane.
 

Sadist

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Saw some doctor traversing the multiverse

Overall I enjoyed the movie a lot, but with just a few things I didn’t care for;

  • America, while I like her, stays pretty flat overall. She’s like a superhuman McGuffin.
  • Not every line worked, did it? Some things felt off.
  • While I like Wanda going full witch, Marvel just seems hellbent on villainizing Wanda huh? On the pages and the screen.

Things I do like

- This movie being Raimi as fuck, full with Evil Dead stuff and Bruce Campbell. I loved the post credits scene lol.

- Cumberbatch seems pretty comfy with his role now, I like it.

- Wanda going full Scarlet Witch is pretty cool. She had some cool moments like the attack on Kamer-Taj, the fight with Strange… but she can’t get catch a break huh? Hope this won’t be the last time seeing her.

- Seeing the Iluminati on screen… Aw yeah. Kraszinski with his Marvel role! He looked cool like Richards. Black Bolt, Maria Rambeau, Captain Carter… but man hearing Xavier appear with the X-Men animated tune was chefs kiss.

- And incursions getting dropped… oh man if that’s the way we’re heading towards fuck yea
 

chocolate_supra

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Saw some doctor traversing the multiverse
Who?
I'm sorry

Seriously though
I just googled what incursions lead to in the comics, and now I can't believe that having incursions and the Fantastic Four both debut in the same movie is a coincidence. F4 will give us Doom, then the multiversal incursions will give us God Emperor Doom and Secret Wars.

Brb taking that to the bank right quick.
 
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Sadist

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In regards to incursions, multiversal threats;

This is going to open up a lot of possibilities and break open a lot of weirdness in Marvel stuff;

- Multiverse threats have been confirmed, but with incursion being introduced now, no way they will keep it a random namedrop. I can totally see these events leading into an eventual Secret Wars event movie.

- First point; the Iluminati. This is a different version of them, and different versions have existed during Hickman’s Avengers/New Avengers run. They already had one thing in common with the comic counterpart, this is a version that failed to save their planet from an incursion.

- They fear Strange. While they might have given the explanation that Stephens are very bullheaded in every universe, but I don’t think that’s it. They will probably know what he will become eventually;

- … which brings us to the Dr Strange will return card, his third eye and Clea talking about stopping incursions. Strange while a hero can also be morally ambiguous, which he already demonstrated in the past few movies (Reading Forbidden books, giving the timestone to Thanos, using the Darkhold etc.) and I think if the third movie is just about Stephen stopping incursions with Clea, I can totally see the latter taking the Black Swann role, warning about Rabum Alal and the Black Priests.

- On The Avengers side, Kang will be the next threat, but after defeat he will definitely will be revealed as the guy who secretly wanting to save the earth, as Earth 616 will be the epicenter of incursion activity. His defeat will only cement that even more threatening powers will be coming for earth.

- I’m all for this set up, just give us Doom to really kickstart things.
 

Dunban

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Saw that same doctor traversing the multiverse. I quite liked the movie but one part was a bit weird to me.

Is there any explanation about why Wanda seem to stop draining America's powers before Stephen got there? Was it just me that thought it was weird that it looked like she was just standing around?
 

Dardan Sandiego

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Wanda Maximoff in the Multiverse of Mid-mess (feat. Doctor Strange and America Chavez) amirite fellow marveldrones?
 

Phosphorescent Skeleton

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Watched the 2005 Fantastic Four and the Nick Cage Ghost Rider last night, and didn't think they were significantly worse than anything in the mcu.
 

Clov

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Watched the 2005 Fantastic Four and the Nick Cage Ghost Rider last night, and didn't think they were significantly worse than anything in the mcu.

The first Ghost Rider had the potential to be Venom-level good! If only it was a bit shorter. There's a lot to love in it, like the Ghost Horse, and the idea of a world where Eval Kineval style stunts are still popular.

The part where Ghost Rider went and destroyed a sign that said "Garage" to say "Rage" while laughing floored me. Absolutely incredible.

If they ever make a new Ghost Rider, they need to just use the same CG tech they used in this one. Laughed every time I saw him!
 

YoboD

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Having finally seen Multiverse of Madness, I feel like it has kind of confirmed what I already suspected in that I don’t think that MCU is for me anymore. After so many years of following this universe from the first Iron Man I haven’t really been engaged by anything I’ve seen post Endgame, and I think a big part of that is I’m just bored of the Marvel style of film making.

For anyone that doesn’t have that problem you’ll probably love Doctor Strange, and a lot of the effects and directorial touches from Raimi are really cool and genuinely unsettling even if I wasn’t really a fan of the plot or character writing.
 

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I‘m up to date with the MCU up to Endgame. Haven’t seen any of their recent tv shows or movies: the last 2 Spider Man movies, Wandavision, Loki, Captain Falcon and the Winter Soldier, etc.

So I humbly ask, in your opinion and in the least spoilery way, what do I need to watch before Dr. Strange?
 

chocolate_supra

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I‘m up to date with the MCU up to Endgame. Haven’t seen any of their recent tv shows or movies: the last 2 Spider Man movies, Wandavision, Loki, Captain Falcon and the Winter Soldier, etc.

So I humbly ask, in your opinion and in the least spoilery way, what do I need to watch before Dr. Strange?
Spidey Far From Home
Spidey No Way Home
WandaVision
Loki

(Events in Loki, WandaVision, and No Way Home lead directly to Strange, and Far From Home is necessary to understand No Way Home)
 


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