TV HBO's The Last of Us |ST| You know Ellie, we really are an ST subtitle [MARK SPOILERS]

hologram said:
Interestingly, in the official podcast they talked about one of the main themes being "love can be a force for bad", specifically how love can make you do terrible things. To me, that suggests that they're still going to frame Joel's ultimate decision as selfish and damaging, which in turn makes the story in TLOU2 the natural direction to go.

@Heron, I'd be curious to see what it was about the story the people you've talked to didn't like. Was it as simple as "Joel dies"? Was it the overall bleakness? Was it the (perceived, incorrectly IMO) lack of resolution to Ellie's revenge arc?
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Regarding TLoU 2 (and this is from a friend group of mostly college educated Irish guys in their 30s): (MAJOR TLoU 2 spoilers, don't read if you haven't beat it)
No one had a problem with Joel dying - everyone seemed to think it was a natural way for the story to progress. His story was over, this was about Ellie. He was a violent guy who killed many, he was killed in revenge. Live by the sword, die by the sword. It made sense. No problem.

The main problem by far was the bleakness and the explicit, graphic violence. After that was the story structure and pacing.

Basically, in TLoU the darkness comes from the outside. You fundamentally play as a man escorting a vulnerable girl in the hopes of saving the world. The fact that the ending upends that is what makes it interesting, but the story is a hopeful one, where you are explicitly the good guy, even if the character himself is painted in shades of grey. It also appeals VERY strongly to parents.

TLoU 2 is the opposite. You ARE the darkness. You are on a sick, twisted, meaningless quest for revenge for a guy who frankly had it coming, and you perform ever more nasty and graphic acts of violence until you murder a pregnant woman. The game seems to assume you'll be on board with this becuase you'll be angry that Joel died - but no one I know was. No one was particularly angry at Joel's death, no one wanted to go on this quest for revenge, everyone felt uncomfortable.

Then the game spends its entire second half saying, "Hey, you know all those people you killed? Guess what, they were just normal people!" Which is the biggest, most unsubtle "no shit" ever, and just seems like gratuitous misery porn. "Hey you know that dog you stabbed? Now you can pet him and see what a good boy he was!" Personally, I was rolling my eyes at a lot of this stuff. Did we really plod through all of that just to be told that "Revenge is wrong, violence breeds violence?"

Lastly, the flashback sections - some loved them, others (like me) thought they were downright maudlin.

But the main complaint was the bleakness and violence.

EDIT: Most people I know actually liked the very last section with Ellie in California and thought the ending was decent - even good. But the journey wasn't worth it.
 
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Heron said:
Regarding TLoU 2 (and this is from a friend group of mostly college educated Irish guys in their 30s): (MAJOR TLoU 2 spoilers, don't read if you haven't beat it)
No one had a problem with Joel dying - everyone seemed to think it was a natural way for the story to progress. His story was over, this was about Ellie. He was a violent guy who killed many, he was killed in revenge. Live by the sword, die by the sword. It made sense. No problem.

The main problem by far was the bleakness and the explicit, graphic violence. After that was the story structure and pacing.

Basically, in TLoU the darkness comes from the outside. You fundamentally play as a man escorting a vulnerable girl in the hopes of saving the world. The fact that the ending upends that is what makes it interesting, but the story is a hopeful one, where you are explicitly the good guy, even if the character himself is painted in shades of grey. It also appeals VERY strongly to parents.

TLoU 2 is the opposite. You ARE the darkness. You are on a sick, twisted, meaningless quest for revenge for a guy who frankly had it coming, and you perform ever more nasty and graphic acts of violence until you murder a pregnant woman. The game seems to assume you'll be on board with this becuase you'll be angry that Joel died - but no one I know was. No one was particularly angry at Joel's death, no one wanted to go on this quest for revenge, everyone felt uncomfortable.

Then the game spends its entire second half saying, "Hey, you know all those people you killed? Guess what, they were just normal people!" Which is the biggest, most unsubtle "no shit" ever, and just seems like gratuitous misery porn. "Hey you know that dog you stabbed? Now you can pet him and see what a good boy he was!" Personally, I was rolling my eyes at a lot of this stuff. Did we really plod through all of that just to be told that "Revenge is wrong, violence breeds violence?"

Lastly, the flashback sections - some loved them, others (like me) thought they were downright maudlin.

But the main complaint was the bleakness and violence.

EDIT: Most people I know actually liked the very last section with Ellie in California and thought the ending was decent - even good. But the journey wasn't worth it.
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Interesting. I can definitely understand most of those arguments, but it's not a response I've seen much of. From playthroughs I've watched, the common sentiment seems to have the following progression:
  • while playing as Ellie, people are uncomfortable with how brutal she is being, especially when she tortures Nora, kills Alice (the dog) and then kills Owen and Mel. But, even through the discomfort, people seemed to... if not outright agree, at least rationalize what she was doing, and thought Abby (and weirdly, Manny lol) had it coming so it was kinda like "ends justifies the means"
  • when you first take over as Abby, the sentiment I say was "what? No. No. Don't make me play as her", followed by "ah okay so she was the doctor's daughter, makes sense, I still don't like her", followed by horror as they slowly realized you were going to have to play the whole three days as her. But, once the Lev/Yara plot got going, people bonded with her more and by the end I think most didn't want to kill her

I think I was somewhere between you and your friends, and the YouTubers I've watched. I was sad when Joel died, but totally understood. It served the story, and I could see why many people would want him dead. But when playing as Ellie I was invested and, even though I was definitely uncomfortable with the violence, I didn't really question it. So the switch worked particularly well for me, as I think I was in a pretty good position to sympathize with Abby more quickly.

I really enjoyed the flashbacks - it was nice to hang out with Joel, and the museum in particular was very heartwarming - but enjoyment aside they did serve a very important narrative and thematic purpose. At the start of the game, it's not clear how much Ellie knows, but I think the default assumption is she still believes Joel's story. As you watch more flashbacks, it becomes more and more clear that she suspected something was up, until finally they confirm she knows the full truth. The fact this leads to her "break-up" with Joel supposedly explains why she's so single-minded in her revenge: she never got closure with Joel.

The last flashback changes everything. She did get closure with Joel, and was on a path to forgiveness which was prematurely ripped away. Her sparing Abby is obviously her finally coming to terms with forgiving Joel, and it made the ending work very well for me.

But yes, I definitely see the complaint of the level of violence, and I suspect the show would tone it down at least a bit because they don't want people to stop tuning in. I'm more interested to see what they do with the structure. I honestly don't know whether it would really work for a TV show
 
hologram said:
Interesting. I can definitely understand most of those arguments, but it's not a response I've seen much of. From playthroughs I've watched, the common sentiment seems to have the following progression:
  • while playing as Ellie, people are uncomfortable with how brutal she is being, especially when she tortures Nora, kills Alice (the dog) and then kills Owen and Mel. But, even through the discomfort, people seemed to... if not outright agree, at least rationalize what she was doing, and thought Abby (and weirdly, Manny lol) had it coming so it was kinda like "ends justifies the means"
  • when you first take over as Abby, the sentiment I say was "what? No. No. Don't make me play as her", followed by "ah okay so she was the doctor's daughter, makes sense, I still don't like her", followed by horror as they slowly realized you were going to have to play the whole three days as her. But, once the Lev/Yara plot got going, people bonded with her more and by the end I think most didn't want to kill her

I think I was somewhere between you and your friends, and the YouTubers I've watched. I was sad when Joel died, but totally understood. It served the story, and I could see why many people would want him dead. But when playing as Ellie I was invested and, even though I was definitely uncomfortable with the violence, I didn't really question it. So the switch worked particularly well for me, as I think I was in a pretty good position to sympathize with Abby more quickly.

I really enjoyed the flashbacks - it was nice to hang out with Joel, and the museum in particular was very heartwarming - but enjoyment aside they did serve a very important narrative and thematic purpose. At the start of the game, it's not clear how much Ellie knows, but I think the default assumption is she still believes Joel's story. As you watch more flashbacks, it becomes more and more clear that she suspected something was up, until finally they confirm she knows the full truth. The fact this leads to her "break-up" with Joel supposedly explains why she's so single-minded in her revenge: she never got closure with Joel.

The last flashback changes everything. She did get closure with Joel, and was on a path to forgiveness which was prematurely ripped away. Her sparing Abby is obviously her finally coming to terms with forgiving Joel, and it made the ending work very well for me.

But yes, I definitely see the complaint of the level of violence, and I suspect the show would tone it down at least a bit because they don't want people to stop tuning in. I'm more interested to see what they do with the structure. I honestly don't know whether it would really work for a TV show
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The progression you've laid out there is quite obviously what the writers intended. But it didn't land for most of the people I know.

Re the flashbacks - I fully understood the thematic reason behind the flashbacks leading up to the all-important "did she know" question, but it made it worse not better for me. She KNEW that Joel had killed a bunch of Abby's people. She KNEW he had it coming. But out of her own egotistical tunnel-vision desire for vengeance she decided she'd kill, what, like 50 people, many unrelated to Joel's death - anyway.

I don't know if you're familar with the concept of the "moral event horizon" but Ellie crossed multiple in this game. To the point that it was impossible to really care about what happened to her by the end. So by the time you find out that she knew it's just one last piece of evidence in the "what a psychopathic piece of shit" ledger.
 
Someone should screencap this spoiler tagged conversation for being the most civil and nuanced disagreement about TLOU2 on the planet. Well done, friends.
 
Heron said:
The progression you've laid out there is quite obviously what the writers intended. But it didn't land for most of the people I know.

Re the flashbacks - I fully understood the thematic reason behind the flashbacks leading up to the all-important "did she know" question, but it made it worse not better for me. She KNEW that Joel had killed a bunch of Abby's people. She KNEW he had it coming. But out of her own egotistical tunnel-vision desire for vengeance she decided she'd kill, what, like 50 people, many unrelated to Joel's death - anyway.

I don't know if you're familar with the concept of the "moral event horizon" but Ellie crossed multiple in this game. To the point that it was impossible to really care about what happened to her by the end. So by the time you find out that she knew it's just one last piece of evidence in the "what a psychopathic piece of shit" ledger.
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Yeah, that's fair. Like I said, I don't really know many people who had that take, but it of course depends on your circle etc (or who you watch on YouTube* lol). Ellie for sure crossed the moral event horizon, but I guess - and I suppose this was also the intended response of the writers, although clearly not one that universally landed - I was still emotionally attached enough to her to still want a happy ending for her.

Anyway, I'm interested to see where they go with it!

*That's not to say I didn't see YouTubers who didn't like the game, but their responses a little less well-articulated than yours lol. E.g. one I saw could only muster a "what a waste" upon finishing the game 😂
ngpdrew said:
Someone should screencap this spoiler tagged conversation for being the most civil and nuanced disagreement about TLOU2 on the planet. Well done, friends.
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Well, I think it helps that we're here rather than... you know...
 
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I think I ruined myself on this series l. I'm a veteran of both games and wasn't hyped about this show but I was curious.

I forgot how dour the world of the The Last of Us is. I'm fairly certain that I won't be tunning in going forward. Pro Trip, don't watch certain things while, ehm, under the influence.
 
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Its interesting to see that people name the bleakness and violence as something that turn people off on the games. It might be just me, but I think it’s one of the better aspects of the series.

GAME SPOILERS (For both Part I and Part II)

From my point of view, there wasn’t a clear case of Joel being the good guy. In the end the Last of Us paints a very bleak and quite possibly correct vision of how a pandemic like the one in the game would essentially end modern society. Might be something that people find horrifying, but the way people are acting and surviving is how I expect them to be. Acting on their sole purpose to survive and do anything to do so. Perfectly honest, I wouldn’t survive in that world. And to be honest, that would be for the best.

Part I for me was not following Joel as a hero or the game making me believe he is one, it’s a story about him finding something he had lost for twenty years, a true connection and something resembling his humanity. The game was never subtle about it; him being a smuggler for the wrong reasons. Ellie asking him if he ambushed people to stay alive and not responding to that question at all. Joel wasn’t an ass by choice of course, it’s the world that pushed him towards that role. Sure he could have rejected that, but that would have killed fairly quickly.

Still, you came to care for both him and Ellie, because they were the right people for each other at the right time. What people appreciated about that is that Ellie finally met someone who cares for her and Joel, for the first time in two decades actually gave a shit. It was a bright light in a bleak world.

In Part II, that relationship evolved and to see it destroyed sucked, but I found it fascinating how Ellie was consumed by blind rage and went further down the rabbithole. Its pure trauma. Kind of reminded me of Spec Ops The Line, where the main character lost himself in a war and completely loses sight, becoming traumatized.

The same applies to Abby; it wasn’t the game telling you “oh hey Abby had her life as well, we flipped the mirror, haha!” but it was about her coming to terms with her trauma and discarding any sense of human emotion she had in her search of Joel. And when her goal was met, all that was left was complete emptiness.

Abby’s return to something like a human being was set in motion with Lev appearing. Same arc as Joel really.

Back to Ellie, I know people thought of her as a monster, did not care for her etc. but I think she was a tragic character in the end. Her chance to patch things up with Joel was taken away, the only parental figure she ever had.

And it’s her own fault, she should have talked with her friends and open up about the trauma. But she made her choice and it will haunt her forever. And that’s her own fault.

Although I have to admit, Ellie was fine-ish after Seattle (apart from the PTSD she gained) but I blame her last piece of bloodlust on Tommy; if he didn’t egg her on she never would have gone after Abby again. Fuck Tommy.
 
I had never seen Mazin's work on Chernobyl before, so I ended up finally starting it, after some friends urged me to check it out.

I've gone through the first three episodes, and "harrowing" would almost be an understatement... especially with regard to the first episode. Just masterful stuff, honestly. It's really no wonder TLoU is as well adapted as it is.
 
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I normally am not someone who stays up to date with all of the "hot" TV shows going on today, but between Rings of Power, House of the Dragon, and this show, I have been super spoiled of late.

First, I love the prologue scenes that has gone on in the beginning of both episodes. They are really trying to hammer in that there is no hope for a cure which makes Ellie situation all that more miraculous. I'm not sure how much pre-outbreak day they still have, but I that part has been amazing so far.

The episode itself takes a while to get cooking, but that was fine because we got to see more world building. Joel clearly wants nothing to do with Ellie and it basically takes a dying Tess to convince him to stick with Ellie. The bit about the connected fungus was neat and helped set the end of the episode. Her end ran a little different from the game, but I think it was handled very well. Some early snooping tells me the internet is in a frenzy over that clicker kiss.

And the clickers. Wow did they ever nail it right. The clickers looked gorgeous (in a terrifying way), just like in the games. The clicking noise was just as terrifying. The whole museum scene was great. Between the tension of getting attacked, the way that the clickers moved, and how those things are bullet sponges, the show has completely nailed the feel of the game.

And speaking of tension, did anyone else expect the doctor in the beginning to get infected during the autopsy? I did not expect her to walk out of that room lol.

Lastly,
I wonder how they will handle Ellie's back story with Riley? Since the Left Behind storyline goes for more than a few minutes, I wonder if they will just give half an episode or so to it, or have various flashbacks.

That hour flew by really fast. Supposedly next week's episode is 80+ minutes long so it will be juicy.
 
I feel like this show is giving Neil Druckmann so much extra stuff to go for for the next game.

The whole backstories of the beginning of the infection are really great, and I absolutely adore the hive mind aspect. It really makes a lot of parts of the first game, make so much more sense. Whenever you have that rush of infected, it just really makes a lot of sense.

I really liked Last of Us Part 1 and 2, but I cannot say that I was chomping at the bit for a third one. But if Neil takes all of the extra stuff in the show, and somehow incorporates it into the game. Oh boy well, I cannot wait for that.
 
Didn't like this episode half as much.

The opening scene didn't add anything of worth - it's answering questions we don't really need to know, and seems to be there just to have a pre-infection scene to contrast with the current world again. We've already been told there's no cure/treatment/vaccine for this thing because it's a fungal infection.

Connected clickers and the kiss were also all pretty damn stupid to me.

There's no doubt that knowing what's going to happen is totally sapping the sense of dread or drama for me. Makes me wonder if I'll continue.
 
Heron said:
Didn't like this episode half as much.

The opening scene didn't add anything of worth - it's answering questions we don't really need to know, and seems to be there just to have a pre-infection scene to contrast with the current world again. We've already been told there's no cure/treatment/vaccine for this thing because it's a fungal infection.

Connected clickers and the kiss were also all pretty damn stupid to me.

There's no doubt that knowing what's going to happen is totally sapping the sense of dread or drama for me. Makes me wonder if I'll continue.
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I don't agree about the cold open. Given that we are living in a pandemic that has been brought under something resembling a kind of control (well, we have vaccines), I think you need to show viewers in as many ways as possible why a contagion like this is different. I could see someone with no familiarity with the license asking why, in 20 years, there has been no medical breakthrough of any kind save for a kid whose bite mark doesn't look so bad. The cold open answers that, and the way the professor reacts (knowing that this is basically the end of the world as we know it) does a lot of heavy lifting in setting the stage for why things went down the way they did.

And it also sets a precedent for bombing a population center, which might seem ridiculous if you only saw it in that one segment in Boston.
 
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I thought the second episode was also great. I don't think it was quite as good as the pilot, which was one of the best pilots I've seen in a while, but still very solid

Looking forward to the next one a lot, according to reviews it's a highlight of the season
 
Finished episode 2, liked it.

- Bella is really good as Ellie. I like how she goofs at the hotel, it’s something what happened in the game too.

- The cold open is interesting; I know people would argue about “why isn’t science helping”, but the sheer terror in the eyes of the professor when she said “bomb it” is amazing. Especially with the army guy just gawking at her and her asking him to drive her to her family is gutwrenching.

- the museum part is awesome; the clickers have been brought to the small screen in an amazing way.

- You know what I like? The emphasis on the spores being a hivemind. It just wants to infect other living things.

- The Tess being infected part is.. hard to look at. I already know without looking that the infected “kissing” her will rub people in the wrong way, but it’s just the hivemind infecting another healthy body.
 
Loved the new episode, it flied by , the cold openings are great , hopefully we will have several for all the scheduled episodes. I'm willing to bet that in these cold openings we will have the Left Behind part but let's see.

Concerning Tess'
Kiss

I believe there is some discussion to have there, here is one interesting article discussing it (although , please mind that i consider TWP hot garbage in general) https://www.washingtonpost.com/video-games/2023/01/22/last-us-episode-2-tess-death/
 
Fercho said:
Loved the new episode, it flied by , the cold openings are great , hopefully we will have several for all the scheduled episodes. I'm willing to bet that in these cold openings we will have the Left Behind part but let's see.

Concerning Tess'
Kiss

I believe there is some discussion to have there, here is one interesting article discussing it (although , please mind that i consider TWP hot garbage in general) https://www.washingtonpost.com/video-games/2023/01/22/last-us-episode-2-tess-death/
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Behind a paywall, but I assume some of the discussion is

that she was already infected so it was as if the fungus was just “reattaching” or some such thought? I will make my own post about my issues with the tendrils.

Regarding Left Behind

I don’t think that’s I’ll be a cold open because we have seen in the previews at least the carousel/Photo Booth scene and one of Ellie scratching her fresh bite. I think it will have a larger part and maybe seven I’ve multiple episodes as flashbacks

I do agree that the cold opens are perfect for this and set the stage for how unstoppable the infection will be.
One of my problems with the first game was it sort of ignored the infected as the big scary thing after a while
 
Barely Able said:
Behind a paywall, but I assume some of the discussion is

that she was already infected so it was as if the fungus was just “reattaching” or some such thought? I will make my own post about my issues with the tendrils.
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The article discusses more the intention and implication of changing Tess death this way. Including the changes they made to Tess' character to a more softer light than in the game. Craving Joel's love which is not reciprocal and compared it with the sexualized imagery of the "kiss"

Some snippets:

Another possible meaning is relevant to Tess’s relationship with Joel. Before dying, Tess tells Joel she never asked him to feel the way she felt (meaning: to reciprocate her love). The zombie kiss is a grotesque inversion of what Tess seemed to want very badly from Joel: intimacy, closeness, oneness. But this closeness comes at a cost: a loss of both her identity and humanity.

There’s a last interpretation, one that’s less charitable. The kiss is clearly nonconsensual, a grim fictionalization of rape culture and the kind of brutish behavior so many people suffer even in our current non-apocalypse. (You can read this as thoughtful critique or thoughtless reproduction.) And perhaps the showrunners, who are men, did not think about whether it might be cruel or send a weird message to subject one of the show’s most prominent female characters (so far) to an even worse fate than she suffered in the game, and in a more lurid way at that.

Trying to parse the meaning of the kiss also raises the question of how you watch TV. In the case of “The Last of Us,” I think there are roughly two types of viewers. There are those who buy into the fiction of the show and interpret the stuff that happens on screen very plainly, as a story. Then there are those who watch the show and see it as the product of hundreds of people’s work and view the proceedings as borne of creators’ choices. It’s the difference between saying “I can’t believe Joel did X” and “Why did Mazin and Druckmann create an episode where Joel did X?”

Because The Last of Us franchise has existed for nearly 10 years, a lot of people are instinctively in the latter camp, having seen Druckmann in particular elevated from random game director to minor celebrity within video game culture. And my first reaction (ick!) leaned that way too. Why, I wondered, did these two creators opt for what seemed to be just a more disgusting televised death for Tess? Having spent some more time with the scene while working on my recap of the episode — and trying to think about it on its own terms — I think the way the show plays the scene is the second interpretation, the one that centers on Joel and Tess’s relationship. The whole episode is about their dynamic, and how Tess and Joel differ in their relation to Ellie
 
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Here are my thoughts. I will spoiler it all just to be safe.

Pros:

  • Ellie from early Part 1 works so much better in a TV medium because you get to focus on her a lot more. In the game, they obviously needed her to sometimes be an escort character and not cause you massive headaches. Here she can be a wildcard for alerting infected/making noises, etc. Also Ramsey has a great whit and characterization. Will be fun to see how it progresses in the darker moments of her character.
  • Love the change over from FEDRA being the ones that show up at the capital building to the infected. Keeps the focus on these being the ultimate antagonist and has higher stakes for the whole “make a vaccine” storyline.
  • Clickers couldn’t have been done any better. Intense scene, scary character, look amazing. Just perfect
  • Cold open laid a lot out for how the infection started and how the tendrils work (somewhat). Also like that they keep messaging the point about no medicines or vaccines. Keeps driving home that Ellie is very important. Also like that the scientist says to bomb everything. They circle back to that when traveling Boston, and it helps to show how the city was destroyed in such a short period of time.
Cons:

  • Not a fan of the tendrils over spores. I think it is because I am a microbiologist, but the whole life cycle of this fungus involves infecting a host, directing it to an area with proper conditions for propagation, and then forms the fruiting bodies to create the spores. Then cycle continues. I’ve read that “tendrils are better for TV” but I don’t buy it. Imagine a spore infested area and the cinematography and playing with light that could be done. It’s not too bad I guess from a bite-and-tendril-gets-in-wound aspect, but prefer the other way.
  • My biggest issue though is the idea that the infected are interconnected because there is a giant mycelium under the city. I can buy that one exists, but I don’t see how they all would be interconnected if these organisms are infected with what’s essentially a separate organism (even if genetically identical). How does the connection take place if the infected can run around freely? They wouldn’t be connected to the main organism anymore. Doesn’t make sense to me.
 
Magic-Man said:
Brilliant episode, but

I AM IN PAIN
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I definitely teared up but tbh they had about as good a life as would be possible in this world

Fercho said:
Loved the new episode, it flied by , the cold openings are great , hopefully we will have several for all the scheduled episodes. I'm willing to bet that in these cold openings we will have the Left Behind part but let's see.
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Barely Able said:
Regarding Left Behind

I don’t think that’s I’ll be a cold open because we have seen in the previews at least the carousel/Photo Booth scene and one of Ellie scratching her fresh bite. I think it will have a larger part and maybe seven I’ve multiple episodes as flashbacks
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Just FYI, (spoilers for episode titles), episode 7 is called "Left Behind" so I imagine that's where we'll see that play out
 
I thought Frank would die when he went to bed with Bill. It hovered on his face and his eyes closed for so long. I was so happy when he opened his eyes. Two minutes later...... fuck.

I was a little worried about how the relationship seemed a tiny bit rushed at the start, but my god it destroyed me by the end.

Nick Offerman acted his ass off and deserves an Oscar. The way he broke down in the first few scenes with Frank oh my god. He was holding back tears, thankful to finally have someone to talk to.

God I loved this episode.
 
hologram said:
Just FYI, (spoilers for episode titles), episode 7 is called "Left Behind" so I imagine that's where we'll see that play out
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Wonder if it’s post Joel injury content or Riley flashback content. I could see it lining up well with the university timeline wise and also reaching into the Lakeside resort. Either way I think both parts will work around that time from a plot timeline standpoint and Ellie’s emotional development. Would work well to have her two tragic moments interconnected but probably very hard to watch.
 
Well, shit. That was an incredible hour of television.
 
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The episode was beautiful, but the effortless way they tied the "side story" into the show's central theme was just really impressive
Barely Able said:
Wonder if it’s post Joel injury content or Riley flashback content. I could see it lining up well with the university timeline wise and also reaching into the Lakeside resort. Either way I think both parts will work around that time from a plot timeline standpoint and Ellie’s emotional development. Would work well to have her two tragic moments interconnected but probably very hard to watch.
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Well we know that Riley appears, and I don't imagine they got Storm Reid for a one-scene cameo. My expectation is that episode 7 more or less follows the DLC (the episode is even the only one written by Druckman) with the flashbacks mixed in with her caring for Joel. I would guess she likely meets David in the episode too, and learns his true nature at the very end to lead into episode 8
 
Incredible hour or so of TV, I was an emotional wreck multiple times during it. The way they deviated from the game is perfect and plays up to the strengths of the medium- it would be hard to tell that type of story in a video game.
 
Man what chapter, finally was able to watch it today and it really delivered. Though I have one question

How did they manage to have electricity/gas 24/7 and functional gasoline?

IIRC gasoline starts to goes bad after 6 months, and even stored (like in dedicated tank for the gas station) shouldn't be able to last more than 1 year (even if he is pumping it out to other containers it would get in contact with the oxygen)

For gas they do show gas central but I would assume that
1) gas is coming from ducts that would certainly be affected by a global event like this
2) It's finite (granted just one house using it would make it last longer)

For electricty I got nothing, they show the electric engine but well it seems to run on gasoline/diesel and they power up A LOT of things like the fence and all the appliances of the house
 
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Well done Craig Mazin, this last episode was really a great hour of cinema, well written and perfect acting.
 
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Oh man, I was not ready for that. Jeez, that was beautiful. It broke my heart, but it was beautiful.

Both Episode 3 and first game spoilers

When encountering Bill in the game he was so angry at everyone (mostly Ellie because she was annoying) and it was all about Frank leaving; I don’t think he was actually angry about it, but just sad. I kind of felt sad for Bill.

So seeing this fleshed out version of Bill and Frank was beautiful. It was nice, cozy, sweet and just feelgood. For a series twenty years into a post apocalyptic world that’s not the words I’d normally use. But oh man, Nick Offerman was pure fire. I loved their relationship and the final scenes… “I am fulfilled” was, man, I’m beat.

Seeing Joel saying goodbye to three people in a span of days hurt him. Pedro Pascal put in some work too there. Love that Ellie was so giddy about the car.

The open window at the end… sigh. Shit hurts

That was some good ass television
 
Amazing episode, I was not expecting this change (which was a very big change) but it was AMAZING, we were crying during the dinner scene me and my wife, who doesn't play any videogames but fell in love with the show.
 
Went into the comments on a YouTube vid about the episode and right at the top was a spoiler for LoU Part 2 which I’ve only just started. Ffs.
 
YolkFolk said:
Went into the comments on a YouTube vid about the episode and right at the top was a spoiler for LoU Part 2 which I’ve only just started. Ffs.
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I just started as well mainly because I knew I couldn’t avoid spoilers. Debating putting it on “light” just to get through the story content though the combat is much more fulfilling so far in the game with the increase in moveset.
 
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Gay men still scaring alpha males in 2023.
 
I'm obviously in a severe minority here but I didn't love it.

I thought it was a brilliantly made and acted hour or so of TV and a good, gripping watch - I just don't think it fit at all into the story, and certainly not as the third episode. This the kind of thing you might get away with in a season 2 or so, but as the third episode? We've barely got to know the main characters yet. They've only just set out on their journey.

It also seemed so divorced from the world of TLoU. Like, for 20 years these two were just able to live in this compound because Bill was an expert survivalist. That... doesn't really tell us much about Joel and Ellie's journey, does it? What they'll be up against, what they'll find out there, 30 seconds of faceless, pathetically dispatched raiders aside. It just seemed like an excuse to tell a queer love story - a good one - that would have been better suited to some anthology series somewhere. Having Bill die before they reach them only increased that feeling, and a clever piece of writing with the letter, tying Frank to the departed Jess (and thus Ellie) really didn't change how I felt about that, if anything it only drew attention to how artificial the connection seemed.

After it was over, I couldn't avoid the feeling of, "I can't wait for the real episode 3 next week, to see what happens to Joel and Ellie".

This will be controversial, but I wonder if people would be so positive if they had cut away to one hour telling a straight love story. Without that sense of "Finally! Some good damn representation!" I think people would possibly focus more on how out of place and frankly irrelevant this all was. Of course, if my aunt had wheels she'd be a motorbike etc etc...
 
I know this was going to be very controversial episode after it finished. Specially on how homophobic the "Gamer" audience is.

I think this episode is the biggest Rorschach test yet: You have an objectively amazing episode in all asides (Character development, acting, music, peace, structure, cinematography , direction , writing) and YET , people find things to complain and attack.

Different strokes and all, but i wonder if this very same episode will have a different reaction from "certain" sector of the audience if the couple was heterosexual instead of gay.
 
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