StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

[oldpuck]

Do we know how much Ram on the steam deck is actually allocated for the games?

Steam Deck doesn't allocate RAM for the game or the OS in the same way that Switch does. It's a totally different virtual memory architecture, so there is no real apples to apples comparison.

The quantity of RAM has the biggest influence on texture quality. If I had to guess, I'd say that Nintendo's slim OS, added with console specific optimization means that texture quality is probably going to be roughly the same for most games between the two devices.

Nintendo's VM design is better optimized for games, where Steam Deck's is better for a general purpose OS. Because Steam Deck is offering a Windows-like environment for games to run in, it's forced to use a VM design that looks like Windows, which is a general purpose OS.

 

[BDGAME]

okay
1. now i'm just confused

2. on a more seriouse note. does the increase in RAM speed on Switch2 make up for the lower capacity compared to the steamdeck?

Deck has 16, but the OS uses 4 and rest only 12 for games. Switch 2 probably will use 1 for OS and have 11 for games. The difference is small.

By the way, Xbox Series S has only 8 for games.

Probably... but I think we can't compare 1x1 Steam Deck x SW2... I don't know how much free RAM the SD have, the SD runs PC games in other hand SW2 will run games made specific for it, optimization will be crucial. I think SW2 will be much more device than the SD.

Deck has 12 for games.

 

[ozfunghi]

I'm close to 450 paid games (not counting free to plays, demos / beta or any NSO stuff)

450 games? Or 450 dollars?

 

[Discostew]

Do we know how much Ram on the steam deck is actually allocated for the games?

The situation with Steam Deck running games compared to a console is that Steam Deck is basically a PC, and PCs require allocating a certain amount of space strictly for the GPU, from 1GB to 8GB if I recall. So that cuts into the overall 16GB, leaving whatever is left for general usage as "main RAM". Set to 4GB for the GPU, and you have 12GB left for everything else. The problem here is that, depending on the game, it may have to swap data to/from the GPU allocation, especially if you're using a small allocation. This means whatever asset could go into the GPU allocation likely would require having it available in main RAM too. So, possibly 2 copies for various graphical assets, cutting into main RAM even more, plus it has to do a copy when doing swapping, so there is some little clicks depending on how much is copied.

Consoles these days, on the other hand, use a unified RAM configuration, where both CPU and GPU can access any part of the RAM. No separate allocation required. So it never needs more than one copy of graphical assets loaded at any given time. This is why Switch 2 having 12GB of RAM is completely fine compared to devices like Steam Deck which have 16GB.

 

[Earendil]

every day i dream about a return of the king (3D)

it's the coolest thing they've ever done imo, and the improvements to the tech since 2011 plus an 8" 1080p screen would just elevate it. it's something only nintendo can pull off.

i haven't read any papers confirming this but i'm fully convinced that a modified dlss that generates the other eye for low power draw is fully realistic.

EDIT: I also think it's possible they make a VR headset that connects via the USB-C on top

This is something I had not considered. Interesting.

 

[NordVPN]

I think it's a little strange to conflate OLED with pricepoint. OLED is not inherently better or more premium, though can be.

Nintendo will price it where they need to. If they think they can safely take a loss, they could do that to keep it under control. I think it'll be difficult for them - like it's difficult for EVERYONE in the global economy right now, but that even with their best efforts the "safe" price for Nintendo could be higher than we might want or expect.

Nintendo has challenges other console makers do while likely selling their system at a lower price. They need the screen, the Dock, two controllers out of the box, the battery, etc.. I can't say with confidence that it'll be $500, but I certainly can't say with confidence I expect below $400.

i whole heartedly disagree with you
anyone can tell an oled from even a very good lcd, its just plain better, they can be very cheap there are 200 euro phone with 120 hz oled, but saying they are not inherently better or more premium is very hard to defend, i will not buy a phone with an LCD, i traded my switch for a switch oled and my deck lcd for a deck oled (this one was really painfull) because its just better in every sense of the word, and i'm not a rich guy, i think the added value is just that good

 

[Concernt]

i whole heartedly disagree with you
anyone can tell an oled from even a very good lcd, its just plain better, they can be very cheap there are 200 euro phone with 120 hz oled, but saying they are not inherently better or more premium is very hard to defend, i will not buy a phone with an LCD, i traded my switch for a switch oled and my deck lcd for a deck oled (this one was really painfull) because its just better in every sense of the word, and i'm not a rich guy, i think the added value is just that good

Different is not better, and they are absolutely not inherently better.

You may like OLED, you may like it a lot. That's fair. I think for Switch's formfactor I see the benefits of LCD.

 

[Serif]

The greatest distinction with OLED is black levels and contrast.
In a pure black scene or a scene having a lot of blacks OLED is noticeable (Persona 5 Royal for example has so many 'red and black' UI elements that the Switch OLED felt very suited for that game).
But in other more multicolored scenes, I don't think 'anyone' can tell an OLED from a good LCD.

LCDs can be vibrant and have fantastic contrast levels, their blacks may not be 'pitch black' but when your eyes adjust to relative contrast, the difference becomes minimal. My M3 Macbook Air has an IPS LED and it is a very vibrant display with great contrast, I didn't even think about the screen type until I looked it up just now.

In the case of Switch OLED vs Switch LCD, the difference was even more pronounced because the LCD screen of the original model was not laminated. Lamination helps with the vibrance and clarity. The PlayStation Portal's screen is laminated, so it should be feasible on an inexpensive display.

I enjoy OLED displays a lot and have both the Switch and Deck OLED models, but the OLED screen was just one of many reasons for me to upgrade. And the lack of one is not a dealbreaker considering the massive improvement the Switch 2 is promising so far.

I also think getting more 1080p content on a native 1080p screen and the promise of HDR makes the display a straight up upgrade. I do like the Switch OLED's display but right now it's servicing a lot of sub 720p content with no HDR.

 

[yohoopzcrazy]

Was watching this video from 2kliksphillip, "Why can't we upscale videos with DLSS?":



It's a pretty short but straight to the point video, I recommend for anyone that is not too familiar with how DLSS works. And some general topics relevant to Switch 2.

But I don't want to talk about the contents of the video. Instead, I want to bring the attention to a reply buried under someone's comment in the video (with a not-so-friendly term used in their name).

From @cube2fox:

This reminds me, recently there was a siggraph paper where Chinese researchers presented a new upscaling method for games: Unlike DLSS, the new method doesn't use a fixed input render resolution. Instead, the final (properly shaded) pixels a rendered at very low input resolution (much lower than for DLSS), while the pure texture mapped polygons (without any shader effects) are used as input in higher or even full resolution. These input data streams are then used by the ML algorithm to produce the final upscaled image. The results look pretty good because the model knows what the high frequency textures and polygon edges are supposed to look like, and it only has to upscale all the shading / material effects from rather low resolution, which have often mainly low frequency detail anyways.

So I expect that DLSS (and XeSS, PSSR etc) upscaling will get significantly better in the future. Which is interesting as there wasn't much progress in upscaling since DLSS 2 came out several years ago. (Frame generation and frame denoising are a different beast.)

So I can't really say that I understand the principle behind this supposed paper, but it does sound intriguing. I wonder what ya'll make out of this, and also, if this is a real paper, if anyone could share it? @cube2fox didn't reply to another commenter asking for the source.

From what I gather, the TL;DR is that they modified the input data, managing to get away with a much lower rendered internal resolution but still produce comparable results to traditional AI upscaling.

 

[fwd-bwd]

A few weeks ago I wrote about the earnings conference of Foxconn Technology Co. (a Nintendo contracted assembler), in which they disclosed some “game console technologies” and hinted at mass assembly of Switch 2 in Q4. Now we have a concrete financial proof:

(Unit: thousand New Taiwan Dollar)

Foxconn Tech (not the Hon Hai/Foxconn Group, its parent company) just released their November operating revenue—over 11.4 billion NTD. This is their highest monthly revenue since October 2021, a 74% increase MoM, and a whopping 223% growth YoY. Since the company did not forecast any revenue increases for the other lines of business (and I didn’t see any news reports suggesting otherwise), the ballooning income most likely came from Switch 2 assembly.

Note that the number doesn’t indicate the mass assembly only began in November. Although we don't know the contract terms between Nintendo and FTC, manufacturing contacts are commonly structured as Net 30 or Net 60 term, meaning that the payment is due within 30 or 60 days of invoicing. So the mass assembly could start from as early as September.

Edit: an update here

 

[Hermii]

I still find it kinda funny how certain this forum used to be that they would reveal before mass production, myself included.

 

[ILikeFeet]

Was watching this video from 2kliksphillip, "Why can't we upscale videos with DLSS?":



It's a pretty short but straight to the point video, I recommend for anyone that is not too familiar with how DLSS works. And some general topics relevant to Switch 2.

But I don't want to talk about the contents of the video. Instead, I want to bring the attention to a reply buried under someone's comment in the video (with a not-so-friendly term used in their name).

From @cube2fox:



So I can't really say that I understand the principle behind this supposed paper, but it does sound intriguing. I wonder what ya'll make out of this, and also, if this is a real paper, if anyone could share it? @cube2fox didn't reply to another commenter asking for the source.

From what I gather, the TL;DR is that they modified the input data, managing to get away with a much lower rendered internal resolution but still produce comparable results to traditional AI upscaling.

I have yet to find a paper resembling that, and I checked siggraph 2024 and siggraph asia 2024 lists. so just going by the surface detail, one problem is that if you don't have enough input resolution, it doesn't matter how much you change your mip bias. not to mention that low resolution could create artifacts from the lack of detail, even with jittering

 

[Hosermess]

A few weeks ago I wrote about the earnings conference of Foxconn Technology Co. (a Nintendo contracted assembler), in which they disclosed some “game console technologies” and hinted at mass assembly of Switch 2 in Q4. Now we have a concrete financial proof:

(Unit: thousand New Taiwan Dollar)

Foxconn Tech (not the Hon Hai/Foxconn Group, its parent company) just released their November operating revenue—over 11.4 billion NTD. This is their highest monthly revenue since October 2021, a 74% increase MoM, and a whopping 223% growth YoY. Since the company did not forecast any revenue increases for the other lines of business (and I didn’t see any news reports suggesting otherwise), the ballooning income most likely came from Switch 2 assembly.

Note that the number doesn’t indicate the mass assembly only began in November. Although we don't know the contract terms between Nintendo and FTC, manufacturing contacts are commonly structured as Net 30 or Net 60 term, meaning that the payment is due within 30 or 60 days of invoicing. So the mass assembly could start from as early as September.

Depends on how they do their accounting. If they count revenue when the work is invoiced then it doesn't matter when they receive payment for it or what their terms are. Which would mean a November start.

Either way, all the smoke (like actual number crunching, verifiable data smoke) means a 2H 2025 release is not something to worry about (which I'm sure I have said many times before in this thread about various other dates, but...this time)

 

[gabeplays]

A few weeks ago I wrote about the earnings conference of Foxconn Technology Co. (a Nintendo contracted assembler), in which they disclosed some “game console technologies” and hinted at mass assembly of Switch 2 in Q4. Now we have a concrete financial proof:

(Unit: thousand New Taiwan Dollar)

Foxconn Tech (not the Hon Hai/Foxconn Group, its parent company) just released their November operating revenue—over 11.4 billion NTD. This is their highest monthly revenue since October 2021, a 74% increase MoM, and a whopping 223% growth YoY. Since the company did not forecast any revenue increases for the other lines of business (and I didn’t see any news reports suggesting otherwise), the ballooning income most likely came from Switch 2 assembly.

Note that the number doesn’t indicate the mass assembly only began in November. Although we don't know the contract terms between Nintendo and FTC, manufacturing contacts are commonly structured as Net 30 or Net 60 term, meaning that the payment is due within 30 or 60 days of invoicing. So the mass assembly could start from as early as September.

Thank you so much!! between this and the shipping information, I think it's increasingly looking safe to say that mass production has started in Q4 2024. I'm still hopeful for a Q1 2025 release date, but - at the very latest - I think it's safe to say we'll all be playing Switch 2 before next summer.

 

[fwd-bwd]

Depends on how they do their accounting. If they count revenue when the work is invoiced then it doesn't matter when they receive payment for it or what their terms are. Which would mean a November start.

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

 

[Hosermess]

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

Nice. I was wondering about that part of it too. But I can barely concentrate on the accounting work I get paid to do lol wasn't going to look into some other company's, even for fun. Appreciate it once again

 

[LoonTwink]

A few weeks ago I wrote about the earnings conference of Foxconn Technology Co. (a Nintendo contracted assembler), in which they disclosed some “game console technologies” and hinted at mass assembly of Switch 2 in Q4. Now we have a concrete financial proof:

(Unit: thousand New Taiwan Dollar)

Foxconn Tech (not the Hon Hai/Foxconn Group, its parent company) just released their November operating revenue—over 11.4 billion NTD. This is their highest monthly revenue since October 2021, a 74% increase MoM, and a whopping 223% growth YoY. Since the company did not forecast any revenue increases for the other lines of business (and I didn’t see any news reports suggesting otherwise), the ballooning income most likely came from Switch 2 assembly.

Note that the number doesn’t indicate the mass assembly only began in November. Although we don't know the contract terms between Nintendo and FTC, manufacturing contacts are commonly structured as Net 30 or Net 60 term, meaning that the payment is due within 30 or 60 days of invoicing. So the mass assembly could start from as early as September.

Edit: an update here

This is grasping at straws I fear but is there any sense in looking at the exact dollar figures to figure out how many units Foxconn may have made? Rough back-of-the-napkin math tells me around ~$200m in revenue which could be as few as 400k units up to past a million units. But that depends on how much of the unit price counts as revenues for Foxconn. Do the parts etc get paid by Nintendo directly or through Foxconn?

 

[SMD]

I still find it kinda funny how certain this forum used to be that they would reveal before mass production, myself included.

excuse you

 

[gabeplays]

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

Dang. I mean, if this really is true where there's already Switch 2's in retail boxes sitting in a warehouse somewhere, I have to wonder if the announcement will is imminent. If not in December, surely in January.

 

[Adrien190303]

A few weeks ago I wrote about the earnings conference of Foxconn Technology Co. (a Nintendo contracted assembler), in which they disclosed some “game console technologies” and hinted at mass assembly of Switch 2 in Q4. Now we have a concrete financial proof:

(Unit: thousand New Taiwan Dollar)

Foxconn Tech (not the Hon Hai/Foxconn Group, its parent company) just released their November operating revenue—over 11.4 billion NTD. This is their highest monthly revenue since October 2021, a 74% increase MoM, and a whopping 223% growth YoY. Since the company did not forecast any revenue increases for the other lines of business (and I didn’t see any news reports suggesting otherwise), the ballooning income most likely came from Switch 2 assembly.

Note that the number doesn’t indicate the mass assembly only began in November. Although we don't know the contract terms between Nintendo and FTC, manufacturing contacts are commonly structured as Net 30 or Net 60 term, meaning that the payment is due within 30 or 60 days of invoicing. So the mass assembly could start from as early as September.

Edit: an update here

IT'S COMING EVERYONE!

 

[Steve]

Dang. I mean, if this really is true where there's already Switch 2's in retail boxes sitting in a warehouse somewhere, I have to wonder if the announcement will is imminent. If not in December, surely in January.

I'm presuming early January, similar to the Switch

Nintendo Switch Presentation 2017 coming January 13th 2017

The next Nintendo Switch reveal will be livestreamed from Tokyo

www.nintendo.com

 

[Xbro]

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

Yeah you're correct. Usually the revenue is recorded when the customer receives the product. I would assume mass production started in October and they shipped a good deal of units in November.

 

[BreakAtmo]

Need is a relative term. It would definitely be nice to have, and make the system more future proof.

My understanding is that having more RAM than a game actually needs offers no benefit, so it would just add extra costs. And I struggle to imagine a game on Switch 2 that would actually require so much RAM, but wouldn't also require a much more powerful chip.

 

[ILikeFeet]

My understanding is that having more RAM than a game actually needs offers no benefit, so it would just add extra costs. And I struggle to imagine a game on Switch 2 that would actually require so much RAM, but wouldn't also require a much more powerful chip.

you can always load more shit into memory. higher quality assets and whatnot

 

[Dmax3901]

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

Now this... This is podracing.

 

[BreakAtmo]

you can always load more shit into memory. higher quality assets and whatnot

Wouldn't that then be tougher for the GPU to render, so you just end up losing performance anyway? Or are Ultra assets and textures really only relevant to the memory?

 

[GiveMePrime4orEls]

my face when switch 2 actually exists in real life

 

[franzen23]

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

Do we know if something similar happened for the Switch 1 launch? Also how do we know that this is for Switch 2 and not another one of their Foxconns clients?

 

[oracion]

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

The day has finally come for me to commit a crime.

 

[oldpuck]

Also how do we know that this is for Switch 2 and not another one of their Foxconns clients?

See fwd-bwd's previous posts:

However, since Nintendo’s forecasting 12.5MM units of Switch hardware for FY03/2025, a substantial 20% decrease from the last FY, I fail to see how FTC can expect YoY growth unless the assembly of Switch 2 is factored into the forecast.

Foxconn Tech (not the Hon Hai/Foxconn Group, its parent company) just released their November operating revenue—over 11.4 billion NTD. This is their highest monthly revenue since October 2021, a 74% increase MoM, and a whopping 223% growth YoY. Since the company did not forecast any revenue increases for the other lines of business (and I didn’t see any news reports suggesting otherwise), the ballooning income most likely came from Switch 2 assembly.

 

[franzen23]

See fwd-bwd's previous posts:

The prediction is solely based on the fact that Foxconn assembled past Switches, so this increase in revenue means they're assembling Switch 2, according to the poster.

It's possible it's for Switch 2, but i doubt Nintendo is Foxconn's only client. they could just be be assembling for another client

 

[antonz]

The timeline adds up from what we have seen of shipments. Switch 2 is the only new device entering the manufacturing stage in large numbers at the moment. PS5 Pros assembly lines have already been running for some time so would not have any large increase for Q4 as they would be factored into Q3 already

 

[Dekuman]

Thanks, a very good point that I didn’t consider. So I went back to read Foxconn Tech’s financial report:

• Foxconn Tech uses International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS) for their financial reports.
• Under IFRS, revenue is recognized when control of the asset is transferred to the customer.
• Quoting Foxconn’s report: “The Group is primarily engaged in manufacturing and sales of consumer electronics products. Sales are recognized when control of the products has transferred, being when the products are delivered to the customer, the customer has full discretion over the channel and price to sell the products, and there is no unfulfilled obligation that could affect the customer’s acceptance of the products. Delivery occurs when the products have been shipped to the specific location”

If I’m reading this correctly, it suggests that in November there were already (possibly a lot of) completed Switch 2 units in retail boxes transferred from Foxconn to Nintendo just sitting in a warehouse or warehouses somewhere. Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant and my interpretation may be wrong.

If assembly is started Q4 (if i'm understanding corrrectly, you are saying Calendar Q4) then a late H1 launch around April/May would make the most sense if you include inventory build up, and shipping via cargo ships which could be several weeks.

Switch mass production started around September 2016 IIRC, they revealed in October, and launched in March.

 

[necrolipe]

The prediction is solely based on the fact that Foxconn assembled past Switches, so this increase in revenue means they're assembling Switch 2, according to the poster.

It's possible it's for Switch 2, but i doubt Nintendo is Foxconn's only client. they could just be be assembling for another client

I doubt, past almost the entire year, that biggest players outside of Nintendo would make Foxconn Tech results goes this big in November

 

[ILikeFeet]

Wouldn't that then be tougher for the GPU to render, so you just end up losing performance anyway? Or are Ultra assets and textures really only relevant to the memory?

not really tougher, it just affects memory. maybe if you're trying to trace all the triangles in the higher fidelity asset, but that's typically a bad practice anyway

 

[omniryu]

The situation with Steam Deck running games compared to a console is that Steam Deck is basically a PC, and PCs require allocating a certain amount of space strictly for the GPU, from 1GB to 8GB if I recall. So that cuts into the overall 16GB, leaving whatever is left for general usage as "main RAM". Set to 4GB for the GPU, and you have 12GB left for everything else. The problem here is that, depending on the game, it may have to swap data to/from the GPU allocation, especially if you're using a small allocation. This means whatever asset could go into the GPU allocation likely would require having it available in main RAM too. So, possibly 2 copies for various graphical assets, cutting into main RAM even more, plus it has to do a copy when doing swapping, so there is some little clicks depending on how much is copied.

Consoles these days, on the other hand, use a unified RAM configuration, where both CPU and GPU can access any part of the RAM. No separate allocation required. So it never needs more than one copy of graphical assets loaded at any given time. This is why Switch 2 having 12GB of RAM is completely fine compared to devices like Steam Deck which have 16GB.

I had no idea PC games do that.

 

[oldpuck]

The prediction is solely based on the fact that Foxconn assembled past Switches, so this increase in revenue means they're assembling Switch 2, according to the poster.

What would you suggest the other client is for gaming console related revenue?

 

[gabeplays]

Just for better clarity, are those two different screens? one LCD and one OLED?

 

[ReddDreadtheLead]

Deck has 16, but the OS uses 4 and rest only 12 for games. Switch 2 probably will use 1 for OS do you hand have 11 for games. The difference is small.

By the way, Xbox Series S has only 8 for games.


Deck has 12 for games.

Do you have a source on the 12 for games

 

[Serif]

Just for better clarity, are those two different screens? one LCD and one OLED?

iPad Air 1 vs. 2, non-laminated vs. laminated, both LCD.

 

[gabeplays]

iPad Air 1 vs. 2, non-laminated vs. laminated, both LCD.

WOW! thank you so much for clarifying. If you had told me the second screen was an OLED, I would have believed you! the pictures ironically do a good job of showing the typical differences of an LCD vs OLED, with the latter having those richer blacks. I'm curious how an actual OLED screen compares against the Air 2 with the laminated screen.

 

[skywake]

Wouldn't that then be tougher for the GPU to render, so you just end up losing performance anyway? Or are Ultra assets and textures really only relevant to the memory?

Fundamentally the reason memory exists at all is so you can have a storage area that's faster than disk. So it's not just about higher resolution assets but it's also about loading and holding onto more stuff so you don't have to retrieve it from some slower resource

It might be higher resolution assets.... but it might also just be more of the game world at once or something asset that isn't needed now but might be needed. Maybe you just hold onto stuff that has been loaded before for longer before discarding

 

[isshinS]

iPad Air 1 vs. 2, non-laminated vs. laminated, both LCD.

so that is why portal look good coz laminated !

 

[ILikeFeet]

Indiana Jones and the Great Not-Rendered




Indiana Jones and the Great Actually Works Well

 

[Concernt]

If assembly is started Q4 (if i'm understanding corrrectly, you are saying Calendar Q4) then a late H1 launch around April/May would make the most sense if you include inventory build up, and shipping via cargo ships which could be several weeks.

Switch mass production started around September 2016 IIRC, they revealed in October, and launched in March.

This sort of financial pattern could result from production starting in September or October, too, so it doesn't narrow down release timeframes at all. They could have lots ready early next year, or stockpile for a few months.

 

[oldpuck]

Indiana Jones and the Great Not-Rendered

That's one way to keep frame rates up

 

[NXRevolution]

I keep failing to keep up with the threads because life gets busy T_T. I know I can look at the pinned comment, but I like reading through things as they're happening. I did see the foxconn stuff though tonight, how we feeling on this?

 

[fwd-bwd]

Do we know if something similar happened for the Switch 1 launch? Also how do we know that this is for Switch 2 and not another one of their Foxconns clients?

Good questions. Although Foxconn Group (Hon Hai) does have a lot of major clients such as Apple, Foxconn Technology Co. (FTC) is only a subsidiary of Foxconn Group. Although Hon Hai also manufactures PS and XBox, those are handled by other subsidiaries in different regions (IIRC, Switch in Yantai, Xbox in Longhua, and PS in Zhengzhou). This is one of the Group’s strengths, being able to assign competing customers to different factories.

Not only Nintendo is the largest customer of FTC, 70% of the latter’s revenue in 2024 came from Nintendo alone:

Furthermore, according to FTC’s financial guidance for Q4, “game console” is the only segment forecasted to grow QoQ:

Another clue is in the company’s historic revenue data. Before and around the launches of Switch v2, Lite, and OLED models, FTC’s monthly revenues always swelled (tables in spoiler tags below to reduce length). And somehow last month’s revenue just happens to be at the highest level since October 2021—the OLED model launch.

Spoiler: FTC monthly revenue 2019

Spoiler: FTC monthly revenue 2021

So for these reasons, the company’s November revenue growth was most likely generated from Switch 2 assembly. (Or Nintendo is going crazy with Alarmo? Improbable though.)

This is grasping at straws I fear but is there any sense in looking at the exact dollar figures to figure out how many units Foxconn may have made? Rough back-of-the-napkin math tells me around ~$200m in revenue which could be as few as 400k units up to past a million units. But that depends on how much of the unit price counts as revenues for Foxconn. Do the parts etc get paid by Nintendo directly or through Foxconn?

Nintendo pays FTC assembly fees not the value of goods. Unless we know the per unit fee, there’s no way to estimate the number of units made. In addition, FTC probably themselves manufacture some components for Switch 2. If so, the total revenue includes more than the assembly fees.

 

[Raploz]

I wonder why Nintendo wouldn't reveal it before mass production. Usually they don't seem to do that. Maybe it's the effect of having a different president this time around.

 

[ILikeFeet]

Another probable future port, Kingdom Come 2, has console specs out